Originally posted by a_sa_ro:

I'm not an expert in biology

Me neither, but I'll say a few things too.

For starters, it should be either a virus or a bacterium, it can't be both.

Agreed. Ryukishi maybe should have decided one way or another. Although, it's possible the inconsistencies are character mistakes. Some of the talk about Hinamizawa syndrome is by people with questionable knowledge. I'd have to examine the text carefully to know for sure whether there are "authoritative" instances that conflict in this regard.

Also, my parents told me that viruses can't be parasites, as viruses aren't living beings while parasites are living organisms. According to Wikipedia, viruses can be parasites, but I don't really trust Wikipedia and haven't been able to find that claim in any serious document or even article, so I'll stick with viruses not being parasites.

Viruses are a tricky case. They fulfill some, but not all, of the classic requisites for life, so biologists don't all agree whether they are living things or not. The fact that viruses have taxonomic classification says something, though. And they appear to be a relic from the formation of life (maybe). They are, at the very least, on the borderline between living and non-living.

In any case, what is the definition of a parasite? Something that hijacks living things to sustain themselves (and also help them reproduce, maybe)? Or what? I think what that definition is may determine whether viruses can be considered parasites.

As far as pathogens go, there are also prions, misfolded proteins that induce proteins of the normal variant to also become misfolded, and are infamously thought to be responsible for neurodegenerative diseases like spongiform encephalopathy (including "mad cow disease") and Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease. These are much less living things than even viruses are. But they still reproduce, so there's that...

Originally posted by fllthdcrb:

Originally posted by a_sa_ro:

I'm not an expert in biology

Me neither, but I'll say a few things too.

For starters, it should be either a virus or a bacterium, it can't be both.

Agreed. Ryukishi maybe should have decided one way or another. Although, it's possible the inconsistencies are character mistakes. Some of the talk about Hinamizawa syndrome is by people with questionable knowledge. I'd have to examine the text carefully to know for sure whether there are "authoritative" instances that conflict in this regard.

I noted the instances where the pathogen was mentioned. The few times it was described as a virus were at the end of Minagoroshi-hen, when Tokyo is explaining to the Prime Minister about Hinamizawa Syndrome, and in Matsuribayashi-hen in one of Irie's internal monologues. Both are very authoritative, so I don't think it can be chalked up to a character's mistake.

Originally posted by fllthdcrb:

Also, my parents told me that viruses can't be parasites, as viruses aren't living beings while parasites are living organisms. According to Wikipedia, viruses can be parasites, but I don't really trust Wikipedia and haven't been able to find that claim in any serious document or even article, so I'll stick with viruses not being parasites.

Viruses are a tricky case. They fulfill some, but not all, of the classic requisites for life, so biologists don't all agree whether they are living things or not. The fact that viruses have taxonomic classification says something, though. And they appear to be a relic from the formation of life (maybe). They are, at the very least, on the borderline between living and non-living.

I actually wrote about that, but then I realized the post was too long and removed it haha. They are the zombies of biology: neither living not dead (in this case, inorganic).

Originally posted by fllthdcrb:

In any case, what is the definition of a parasite? Something that hijacks living things to sustain themselves (and also help them reproduce, maybe)? Or what? I think what that definition is may determine whether viruses can be considered parasites.

The most basic definition of a parasite is an organism that gains sustenance from a host and causes the host some harm. The harm is not necessarily something major like malaria, it may be minor too, such as bacteria in our intestines taking some of our food even if it doesn't straight up make us ill. The harm they cause is the difference with other relationship types such as mutualism and symbiosis, where organisms can cooperate and even one live inside the other without harming either one. Note that parasites don't necessarily live inside the host: ticks, fleas and the like are considered parasites even if they live outside the host because they sustain themselves off them. Viruses do harm us, but as not-really-living-beings, I don't think we can talk about them "sustaining themselves". They are just genetic code that proliferates by attaching to cells. I wouldn't call them "parasites", but I guess it could be debated.

Originally posted by fllthdcrb:

As far as pathogens go, there are also prions, misfolded proteins that induce proteins of the normal variant to also become misfolded, and are infamously thought to be responsible for neurodegenerative diseases like spongiform encephalopathy (including "mad cow disease") and Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease. These are much less living things than even viruses are. But they still reproduce, so there's that...

I didn't know that. Interesting! Thanks for the info! :)

Since the Hinamizawa Syndrome is tied to a demon god time travel being, I didn't really think much about it. But rather, I guess the question never even came to me before. Interesting.

Does anyone have any more context about the mion question?

Originally posted by DeRockProject (jongyon7192p):

Does anyone have any more context about the mion question?

It sounded like it's some sort of philosophical realization or something. That's about all I can think of. Very little was said about it, so all we can do is think of what great flash of insight a person might have in such a dramatic moment while fighting someone of comparable skill.

In regards the Mion question - to me shes thinking about Takano.

She realises that Okonogi, to preserve his pride, needs to be "beaten" by her, which is why he has the fight with Mion in the first place - the realisation Mion comes to is that Takano hasn't had the same experience, because she hasn't been "beaten" she'll still continue to fight.. if that makes sense?