While you're at it, take out the gold grief and AP removal too. Thx.

Theres nothing wrong with Scarface Pete, Gold Grief, or AP removal.

Scarface Pete is only being used because Ariane is the top tier deck right now. It's a pretty ♥♥♥♥ card, considering that you draw 3 cards anyway every turn. If your deck relies on a single combo and you auto lose if you lose it from pete, thats your fault.

I have literally no idea why you'd say there's too much gold grief. I'd argue that we need more. I'm kinda thinking you were being sarcastic, Shades, but it's hard to tell on the Internet.

AP removal is a pain, but the only decks that can do it effectively are Venescula, Linza, or Ozan. Venescula's aggro doesn't play Treus Dayth, Grief Linza got nearly murdered due to Dust Devil's nerf and the heavy amount of 1AP Ariane running around, and the Hope Devourer nerf has pretty much made that deck all but existant in even mid-level play.

NOTHING ISNT OP. EVERYTHING IS NERF.

Originally posted by TheVoid:

Theres nothing wrong with Scarface Pete

Scarface Pete is only being used because Ariane is the top tier deck right now. It's a pretty ♥♥♥♥ card, considering that you draw 3 cards anyway every turn. If your deck relies on a single combo and you auto lose if you lose it from pete, thats your fault.

Nothing wrong with SP? Most of the time for the cost of 4 health letting your opponent discard 3 cards is a huge deal. It's actually good in any match up. Especially in AP Sustain mirror. That's why 2 SP are run in high lvl AP Raptors. It's not only about disrupting combos but card advantage in general.

In my opinion the card definitely needs a nerf. Either reduce its effect from" discard 3 to 2 cards" or rise the AD of the card.

Scarface Pete is prominent in the meta right now because:

1. Miracle Ariane relies on hand size.
2. Miracle Ariane relies on a few select cards (Earth Blast/Earth Wave) as win conditions.
3. Raptor relies on a few select cards (Barricade/Corp Beast/Vorago) as win conditions (for the AP mirror).
4. Scarface Pete is relatively unpunishing to kill (take 8 damage at 3/4AP, take 4 damage at 5 or more AP, you can even weapon into it if you really want to).

Scarface Pete does not feel fun in the meta if you are hit with it because there is little counterplay to it outside how you built your deck in the first place. With weapon grief for example you can theorise an opponents turn and predict where they will equip a weapon, and punish them for going along standard paths. With Pete, there is no sense of you being read or outplayed. With weapons you can say "maybe I should have moved my combo along 1 slot to avoid that bar fight." With Pete you can't say "If I played this match better I wouldn't have drawn my Vorago till chapter 5." That is why people do not like Pete.

The solution to get around this is to play decks that do not have a few specific win condition cards, the most popular of which at the moment is Aggro Vanescula. The problem with this is Aggro Vanescula has an even matchup vs Raptor running Pete, but has a bad matchup vs Miracle Ariane. With these 3 decks being the most popular right now, you're limiting yourself against a completely different deck, just because you want to avoid being Pete'd.

This leads us into a meta dominated by Ariane and Raptor, where AP Raptor mirror matches are decided by "who got unlucky enough to draw their vorago early and get it discarded. Raptor vs Ariane is a shade better, but Ariane's reliance on a specific few cards as win conditions still let's you be screwed over by some unlucky draws.

Is luck in drawing a necessary part of the game? Of course it is, it's a feature of just about every card game ever created. But Pete moves the issue into punishing you for having a deck that tries to draw consistently so it can find it's key cards.

Until either Pete itself is changed, or the meta around it changes drastically so that the majority of matchups aren't reliant on 2/3 key cards to win, Pete is going to remain a problem card that draws the ire of many.

Well said Banzai. I doubt that they are going to make a change to Pete though as they are actually buffing Ghostship to make it cheaper (2 gold v. 3) to discard 2 cards. I have never been a fan of discard even back to my Magic days (Land destruction too). As you said, it is the lack of counter to discard, especially in this game where you line up 4 cards and hit play. At least in Magic you could interrupt or instant a counter, if you had them.

The buff to Ghostship has actually been cancelled.

i must agree pete is a bit overpowered in some case..most of the time its a win just from it.

1.its rarely punishing to play it as its attack power is kinda low..
2.it can break combo quite easily or make you discard a very important card that would make you win, the draws are already randoms so discard random of random draws..jeez ;X
3.still dosent even need to be a combo as it gives cardss advantages, it can lead you to only 3 cards a turn quite fast if you dont get any draw/dont have any.
4.on the other side there are way more cards to draw than discard but those arent punishing the opponent or completly breaking some combo..
5.compared to ghost ship it isnt that bad, strangely pete seems to be more played than ghost ship(not counting miracle arianne)

in my opinion pete could remain the same, but it would make more sense to make it discard 2 cards instead or raise its power to make it more punishing to use below the required attack.
what would be A LOT more fun is to be able to choose what you discard when those thing happen, lets say choose before timer end or its random(this could be done for potions too..)

That would lead to there being no counter to miracle ariane and it would dominate the meta even harder

If a deck exists in a CCG that is very strong (Miracle Ariane) and is preceived to have only one real counter (Pete), then nerfing of one card is not the issue. It's an issue with the deck in question. I would argue that both Pete and some of Ariane's cards need addressing. Or another option is to chang Pete while also adding counter cards for Miracle. More options, and better in my opinion, than leaving Pete alone.

Here's the issue with Ariane: If they nerf her again, all that they can really nerf is EB and make it 8 gold, and maybe make Earth Wave 6 gold. They can't change EB to a hand size +4, as it'll kill the card and the deck entirely, which is the main Ariane play style. They can't change the EB effect to discard all without breaking the deck either. A lot of Ariane's cards are actually balanced, they just work really really well together.

The main nerfs I think they could do is:
EB 6 gold -> 8 gold
Earth Wave 5 gold -> 6 gold
50 Ships Mufasa gives 5 gold -> 4 gold
Penguin Sheep gives 5 gold -> 4 gold
Wind Surge 6 damage -> 5 damage

However, these are minor nerfs that will slow the deck down but aren't really doing too much in the long run. If you nerf these any further then the cards become irrelevant and you have another Amascut Mystic on your hands (the proposed change, not the actual one, the change that nobody wanted).

Hey more cards i dont like being played against me , NERF!! Yea weirdly this card is the same it was months ago , yet i havent seen people cry about it before .

Even if they nerf the cards in this thread , wait 1-2 weeks and same players will come back with another X card is OP ...

People weren't asking for a nerf a few months ago, because it wasn't being played (for the most part) a few months ago. It's a bit hard to complain about something if it's not happening. That is not, however, a good reason to ignore the card now.

Originally posted by stepmcgee:

People weren't asking for a nerf a few months ago, because it wasn't being played (for the most part) a few months ago. It's a bit hard to complain about something if it's not happening. That is not, however, a good reason to ignore the card now.

wait and they will nerf it like they did with other cards , but then more cards will be screamed at for a nerf ... then they will nerf those cards , and so on , viscious cycle because people are used to copy netdecks ...been using scarface pete x1 in all my ap decks since day 5(was lucky for it to be my 1st ruby ever) .

Easy to complain when the card just makes you salty now because they see more play , because of nerfs to other cards .. which was occured by crying players .

Expecting another nerf this card thread right after they nerf scarface pete , typical playerbase for a card game .

Appreciate the insults.