It's the extrinsic rewards.

Everyone you meet is farming something. Nearly all of them are doing it as fast as they're willing to.
Half of them are focusing on the grind. The other half are being toxic because they think their grind is being messed up.

Every game with a heavy extrinsic reward focus winds up like this. It is what it is.

The notion that any game's multiplayer community ever acted with an semblence of empathy, fellowship, and good sportsmanship always struck me as a fiction because in no game I ever played did I witness it. Ever. The majority voices were always that of selfishness, entitlement, and casual cruelty. Actually nice people were a rare breed.

But eh, maybe I've just been unlucky. For twenty years straight, but hey, it could happen. Or maybe you happened to be lucky in those earlier days, Mr. Bubbles. Not sure which really.

Then there's the other other half that are helpful, revive you, carry weaker players, and give advice. They will solo your Sortie so you don't have to. As with any generalization, it's describing individuals and patterns rather than a true absolute. There are plenty of friendly people playing. But as with humanity, not all of them are.

MekaDovah eredeti hozzászólása:

The notion that any game's multiplayer community ever acted with an semblence of empathy, fellowship, and good sportsmanship always struck me as a fiction because in no game I ever played did I witness it. Ever. Just constant selfishness, entitlement, and casual cruelty.

Warframe has an example of it through the now deceased player Yuri Hazumaki.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/1lr4uft/who_was_yuri_hazuki/

Link has it spelled wrong. But this was a player who was incorporated permanently into Warframe itself as the community held vigils and gathered around them when they died while playing the game. The devs even mentioned them in game, a community-driven memorial was held for them, and this all just happened last year.

MekaDovah eredeti hozzászólása:

The notion that any game's multiplayer community ever acted with an semblence of empathy, fellowship, and good sportsmanship always struck me as a fiction because in no game I ever played did I witness it. Ever. The majority voices were always that of selfishness, entitlement, and casual cruelty. Actually nice people were a rare breed.

But eh, maybe I've just been unlucky. For twenty years straight, but hey, it could happen. Or maybe you happened to be lucky in those earlier days, Mr. Bubbles. Not sure which really.

You find what you look for Ive found. Wether your outright intent or not who you choose to engage with and what you do has a decent bit of bearing over the matter. Lotta artificial pretense in the community, not the the degree where it can be called consistent toxic positivity, but it is near and happens often enough to be observed.

it's because you started paying attention to them

tbh, I still haven't had this interaction for years.

someone already said it but yeah. you started paying attention to them, the toxicity i've encountered has never even rivalled a CoD lobby (well, except for here. but the steam discussions are an outlier half these people profess to be banned anyway)

as for being mute? that's not new. people didn't start being anti-social in 2026. people are mutes 90% of the time in my experiences, even as far back as 2015

Mr. Bubbles eredeti hozzászólása:

Half the time rando's in this game are mutes who never say anything to anybody, The other half they're almost as toxic as a CoD lobby, wtf happened? When did we lose the respect between the tenno?

toxic here is normal but Q&A chat in-game is differently , you won't see any toxin there, especially if you come at Asia & Oceania Region, you will see all friendly helper.

Big China Bill! eredeti hozzászólása:

You find what you look for Ive found. Wether your outright intent or not who you choose to engage with and what you do has a decent bit of bearing over the matter. Lotta artificial pretense in the community, not the the degree where it can be called consistent toxic positivity, but it is near and happens often enough to be observed.

I would not call what I've observed over the years "positive" toxic or not. I also think the notion that it's entirely within my power to simply avoid is misleading at best. Plus it passes the buck of personal responsibility away from the actual instigators. Sure, we can't control others, only how we respond, but that's not an excuse for other people's bad behavior.

Given how multiplayer focused this game is and how regularly people have complaints about bad behavior, sounds like the community could benefit from a bit of self-reflection and self-restraint.

We can't make other people behave, but we certainly do suffer the fallout of their bad behavior. The least we can do is acknowledge their culpability.

MekaDovah eredeti hozzászólása:

Big China Bill! eredeti hozzászólása:

You find what you look for Ive found. Wether your outright intent or not who you choose to engage with and what you do has a decent bit of bearing over the matter. Lotta artificial pretense in the community, not the the degree where it can be called consistent toxic positivity, but it is near and happens often enough to be observed.

I would not call what I've observed over the years "positive" toxic or not. I also think the notion that it's entirely within my power to simply avoid is misleading at best. Plus it passes the buck of personal responsibility away from the actual instigators. Sure, we can't control others, only how we respond, but that's not an excuse for other people's bad behavior.

Given how multiplayer focused this game is and how regularly people have complaints about bad behavior, sounds like the community could benefit from a bit of self-reflection and self-restraint.

We can't make other people behave, but we certainly do suffer the fallout of their bad behavior. The least we can do is acknowledge their culpability.

you curate your own online experience. bad actors can't act to an empty room

MekaDovah eredeti hozzászólása:

We can't make other people behave, but we certainly do suffer the fallout of their bad behavior. The least we can do is acknowledge their culpability.

The problem with this approach is it plays Overlord. Plenty of people in the real world have polar opposite takes on how to handle the same situation and that includes matters of morality and general decency. Some want more oversight and control, some prefer freedom, and some go to the extremes and demand anarchy or zero tolerance. If the player is saying or doing something against the rules of the game, that's likely a bannable offense if you choose to report it (or the game will notice it themselves sometimes). However, if they aren't doing something that the game creators would deem actionable, then insisting they are to blame for committing a wrong is merely your own moral busybody armchair dictation. We can agree as people that certain people are over the top and should be dealt with, but those same people will come to these forums and post about getting unfairly banned for jokes or something that harmed no one. Whether we agree or disagree with them is a personal subjective view rather than some universal constant.

In short, morality and human behavior are tough to judge because everyone has a different take on the subject. There are places where forbidden acts in my country are perfectly legal in another. Even within our states, there are differing laws pertaining to human rights. Naming and shaming is actually against the rules itself so we cannot even directly call out anyone or hold them culpable because it's not our place to do so. Meanwhile, generalizations like the ones presented in this topic do little to acknowledge the silent majority who isn't causing you grief but points mainly to the few that ruin the example.

For me, I just... don't really have much reason to talk.

Sure, I enjoy a bit of chatter, but the only time I 'really say' much is Endless missions in the text chat. One reason behind the toxicity, however, is due to popularity. More people join, more toxic players appear.

Warframe just isn't a game where you need to communicate, thus there's less incentive to do so, even if just to banter.

Queen Yuu The Reclusive eredeti hozzászólása:

For me, I just... don't really have much reason to talk.

Sure, I enjoy a bit of chatter, but the only time I 'really say' much is Endless missions in the text chat. One reason behind the toxicity, however, is due to popularity. More people join, more toxic players appear.

Warframe just isn't a game where you need to communicate, thus there's less incentive to do so, even if just to banter.

if you come at Q&A chat , you can talk all days , i have more time on chat more than what i play on mission.

DeAlph eredeti hozzászólása:

Queen Yuu The Reclusive eredeti hozzászólása:

For me, I just... don't really have much reason to talk.

Sure, I enjoy a bit of chatter, but the only time I 'really say' much is Endless missions in the text chat. One reason behind the toxicity, however, is due to popularity. More people join, more toxic players appear.

Warframe just isn't a game where you need to communicate, thus there's less incentive to do so, even if just to banter.

if you come at Q&A chat , you can talk all days , i have more time on chat more than what i play on mission.

Considering the stupidity that you can be perma-banned over, I refuse to use chats outside of missions or DMs.

I'm not about to get banned over snowflake moderation bots on Warframe. I'm a League player, I've seen worse.

Queen Yuu The Reclusive eredeti hozzászólása:

For me, I just... don't really have much reason to talk.

Sure, I enjoy a bit of chatter, but the only time I 'really say' much is Endless missions in the text chat.

IMO, it's just another symptom of extrinsic rewards.

Not much point talking to people for chatter purposes if the group is splitting after 5 minutes.
As you say, maybe endless missions. I'd add on Sorties and Archon hunts.
That's assuming someone doesn't leave early because they finish farming their extrinsic reward, or because they're dissatisfied with the rate the group farms the extrinsic reward at.

Otherwise everyone's got their own extrinsic rewards to farm, and the chances that they're the same from mission to mission is so low DE changed things to automatically ungroup players after missions.
It's what they'd do anyways, shortly before going and farming a different extrinsic reward.

Same thing happened in Deep Rock Galactic. Before heavy implementation of extrinsic rewards the only reason to split the party was because someone was putting the game down.
When the party stuck together for an hour, they were more eager to talk to each other.
Now everyone's got their own extrinsic rewards to farm and well... we've seen where that led DE.

It's not the end of the world as far as warframe goes. But it is always the extrinsic rewards.

Ittrix eredeti hozzászólása:

It's always the extrinsic rewards.

This game can be played solo and singleplayer. I should hope if they are partying for effortless content then they chose to play this online game knowing player interaction would exist and welcomed it. For some players, myself included, the social experience is the entire point. You don't necessarily need to speak a word though. Wordless bids are also human interaction and there can be comfort or security in the presence of allies. Yet the second the players find out those allies are bots, the experience sours considerably even though the bots play sometimes better than the humans do. It's quite interesting.