Jon Shafer's At the Gates

Jon Shafer's At the Gates

Elhoim 1 FEB 2019 a las 7:01
Some suggestions for a more fun late game
First of all, congratulations on the release! It's a very fun game, and a great foundation for a superb one! I'll share me experience and some humble suggestions on how I think the game could be more fun or interesting.

I started the game and really liked the complexity of the professions and the relationship between them. I also LOVED the resources being consumed, creating some bursts of productions that later forced me to re-arrange my clans to deal with the lack of resources. Until... I discovered the stone buildings. First of all, I ended my first game when I realized that I depleted a lot of useful resource sites that could have worked as a 100% one with stone buildings. So my next game strategy basically became "extract a resource and stop before it's depleted", while looking for a stone deposit. Once you find it, that's it. It's not hard to set up a block cutter. You just need a stone miner, a cutter, and that's it. And the whole resource depletion gameplay it out of the window. I know you intended it as a mid-game situation, but definitely happens very early.

At first I was thinking that stone buildings should deplete deposits, but at a lower rate. At most, they could have the ability to stay indifinitely in the depleted phase, with a lower output. But I also see that the AI really needs some work. IF you were to be assaulted by enemies, the whole structure could change a bit, as you need to defend your borders and settling somewhere more permanently.

What I don't like about them is the completely static nature, in which you build them and that's it, you are settled. Also the specialists slots and such are really not necessary. You can get a huge amount of resources with just the basic stone buildings. In my game the stockpiles are up to the thousands, and I have nothing to spend it on.

Maybe the stone buildings could require some kind of maintenance to work at 100%, and that could tie in to the rest of the resources. For example:

- Mine Shafts consume Timber, Tools and Oil each turn (for repairs, tool replacement and lighting the tunnels).
- Trading depots consume alcohol and horses (for tavern and horse replacements).
- Cattle ranch should consume food, how are you raising those cows?
- Logger camps consume tools.
- Plantations consume tools.

Missing some of those resources won't shut them down but lower their output. The resources are some ideas, but I'm sure you can find a nice balance and dependencies.

But I think that the main issue is that when you finally get some kind of economy running, you realize that the only thing truly needed to finish the game are two things: steel weapons and armors, as you either need them to conquer Rome, or to equip the legions and send them. The rest doesn't really matter much. It would be good to have some kind of economic victory, in which you must sell a certain amount of high tier resources to Rome, so much that they become dependent on your goods supply, that if you cut it their economy would crumble.
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Syriusz 1 FEB 2019 a las 18:11 
Well, crafters in settlement are op too. And to get on stone rush, you do not need source of stone, just need to buy 5 stone and then make coal makers and brick makers. With is good. But the worst thing is that you do not have any dangers at that time. I have never been attacked by AI or been in danger of starvation in "stone age".
I think, that to not make such huge difference between early/ late game, it would be good if plants would regrow every spring and wither before winter... Herds should regrow if left alone too. I even was assuming that it is case, but I think its not. And with that if populations would eat more it would be better. And there are other ideas that I came up with:

-apprentices (plantation/ pasture) should not increase production, but after year they should get "seed" so you could build new plantation/ pasture on tile without resource. That was always weird for me, that in games plants and livestock could not be spread...
-populations should have more needs than just food- clothes, tools and weapons etc. for some professions, parchments, meat and alcohol for nobles and if not met, it would decrease their mood
-advanced structures should require steel tools too, and if respawn of resources would be a thing then normal structures should use normal tools.
-population cap until creating kingdom
-roads should be more usefull (increase speed) but use stone
-caravan should count how much you buy/ sell items and adjust its cost (selling 200 olive oil should not give 200 x 1 olive oil value, but for example half, same with buying, and remember previous trades too)

Maybe those changes would be bad, maybe good, but devs for sure will change something, so maybe something from this list ;-)
Harry 1 FEB 2019 a las 23:21 
This is the 4th long, and thoughtful, post I've seen (or written :P) discussing ideas for the mid to late game. In the "Open Letter" post, Jon and I had some good discussion and ideas on late game that's worth a read if you are invested in brainstorming to make the game better!

Jon, between all these posts and the less constructive rants, I think it is clear that there is a growing fanbase for your wonderful brainchild, something I'm sure you won't take for granted. While getting the long list of game breaking bugs out of the way should be priority, I would strongly recommend getting 50% solution on making late-game fun out here much, much sooner than you planned. September is a long, long time away, long enough to turn the most supportive fans away.
Última edición por Harry; 1 FEB 2019 a las 23:24
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