Dear player. I hope you don't mind, but I posted a pointer to your post to the Discord where INFRA developers and fanatics hang out. I'm sure at least one of the developers will see it there.

My best to you and your family, and I think it's you who are doing the teaching, you just found a useful tool. May you find many more.

Hi Gottköning,

I run the community Discord server and wiki and must say we are absolutely touched by your experience and kind words about INFRA.

Should you ever join, I will be happy to grant you the highest honour awarded to community members, Structural Engineer.

All the best, and glad you had such a nice experience. I have passed this on to the developers and I hope they will give you some well deserved recognition :)

I don't know what to say, but we're happy to know how our game has helped with the task of raising your son while his mother was recovering.

Gosh this is both heartwarming and fascinating ^^
Beyond interactivity and leisure, games do leave an impact, with different intensity and nature depending on people, and sharing the experience is an incredible experience in itself. I remember when I was a kid, I had a lot of interest in how all of these things around me works, water, electricity, transportation. I was struck by this memory while playing INFRA. After playing it, I started to dig some subjects again, with more adult ideas: how it works with environments, economy, things about urbex, etc... A lot of exclusively positive things.
For many reasons, including these, thank you all at Loiste too =)

My son and I we finished our first playthrough just today. The final chapter has a higher pace than the rest of the game so it was in part less enjoyable for him but still, considering the fact that I'm not actually using the game the way it was intended, but to explain things to a two-year-old ... it was a fun experience for both of us.

In the meantime my little guy mastered how to use toilets.
He also started acting like he's taking pictures of things he thinks are broken and need fixing, which is .... not a valuable lesson for life but kind of adorable.
I really don't want to go into making a list of lessons he learned from this game again, but yeah ... it had a huge impact on him and a good one for all I can tell.
I had to take some time to explain to him that "The man" as he refers to the game's protagonist isn't a real person but just a figure like a person in a book or a person you can draw on a piece of paper, but other than that, there wasn't a noticable downside of playing this game with him. As long as I carefully planned every step ahead so we could avoid things that would probably make him feel uncomfortable, as I said a few weeks ago, the game is pretty safe for children.

We could also have a discussion about how there are very few actual learning games for children available on the market, that at least try to give a little general realism. What else should I have shown? Some "game" that sings an ABC song and explains colors in 2D graphics for 59,99$? I can do that on my own without a game. I was thinking about GTA V too but it was impossible to play that game without running into some sort of violence sooner or later, when I tested.
What my son loves about INFRA, besides it being a huge adventure with boats and trains and such, are the small details, like an occasional fire extinguisher or a teddy bear or ... how we were able to buy bottles of Splurt! at a metro station and pretend we would drink them but when I just wanted to throw them away he reminded me harshly to look around for a trash bin. He was so proud he could explain something to me. For a guy his age that is exceptionally great entertainment and lessons to learn. Because someone at Loiste Entertainment put a lot of effort into those little and lovely details. That's what I wanted to compliment on and that's what I wanted to give credit for, hoping that someone who really deserves that kind of recognition would read it and feel good about how I used his or her work for the good purpose of raising a little guy who arguably hasn't had the easiest start in life. I'm just really thankful that this product exists. :-)

So .... I'm looking forward for Whiprock. I gave Open Sewer a testing and liked it but I think it's less suitable for kids. Don't want to sound like an awkward fanboy but I'll probably buy whatever you throw on the market anyway ;-). You earned my consumer trust!

Every time we ended a session of playing INFRA, I moved the protagonist into a dimmer room or place or used the available beds and acted like it was getting late. I told my son that "The man" would be tired by now after solving so many riddles and repairing so much stuff and has to sleep for a while now.
That's were we parked the man. I explained that he has finished his job, saved the city and can rest now.
We will revisit this game in a year or two .... or continue when the DLC is ready to be explored :-)

It's terrific to read your experience. Can I recommend another game which you and your son may find useful ?

https://steamhost.cn/app/580200/Yonder_The_Cloud_Catcher_Chronicles/

This game features many people and animals, and (like GTAV) a huge varied map to explore. You can buy or make things that people want, and you can pet animals and/or domesticate them. Although it does have an ending, of sorts, you can completely ignore it and just explore or do things at random.

Just as with INFRA you may have to tune your gameplay to things your son can appreciate. For instance you can have an inventory with a huge number of things in it and he might find this overwhelming. Or he might enjoy collecting all the weird things. I don't know.

There are a number of properties you can pretend to sleep at overnight. Or there's one specific person at a village you go to early on who offers you a bed for the night any time you go back there.

Thanks for the input!

I tried Subnautica prior to INFRA but only with mild success. In my expectation Subnautica would have been a better game for him, since the fire extinguishers actually work and there are fish and sharks (a topic he loves in books and plays with his real toys a LOT). Still no idea why it didn't catch him. When I played it and he was next to me he hardly gave it any attention. Compared to INFRA were he saw me playing it 5 seconds and asked me to stop playing for a second so he wouldn't miss a thing while he was getting his little chair over to my desktop.
It must be the realism and the details. He can relate to paperwork on a desktop more than to a futuristic underwater setting, I guess. That may be his personality or an age-related thing, I can't tell, it's my first time raising a little guy so I can't know where things will lead to.
He also loves cars and police but actual racing games he thinks are boring.

We only have a month left before he goes to the kindergarten and I go back to working and stop being a fulltime father and caretaker and probably won't be able or willing to spend much rarer time with him sitting on a computer in the middle of the summer unless it's a game he loves as much as he loves INFRA.
It would need to have similar strengths, like the mentioned realistic setting and details, interesting riddles that he can assist in, absolute lack of violence and elements of horror or at least so little of it that I can skip such parts without him noticing that something is missing, aswell as rafts, boats, little trains, helicopters and an abundance of red pickup trucks :D
If anyone has a good idea that isn't too obvious and could be missed easily, feel free to write me via steam chat :-)

I'll check Yonder out for myself. From my first impression now the style of art is probably too abstract to catch him. But as I said, that could change as he grows older. I'd probably put it on a list together with other titles I think could possibly be good on a few years .... like Portal for example.

Still ... thanks :-)

What an awesome story! Thanks for posting this !!

In the meantime we are about to finish our third playthrough. I just wanted to mention that, further complimenting the quality of this game.

What I forgot when I wrote that we would probably not have the chance to play this title again since the last time I wrote here he was about to start his time in kindergarten, is ... well ... newcomers to the kindergarten get sick a lot and so do their parents :D
Which just created endless possibilities to play with my son while also neither of us willing to move around much over the course of the last few months.

I still haven't shown him some sections thinking they would be too scary, like the bunker for example and continously avoid all the minorly frightening moments aswell in the other chapters, which .... basically is my duty .... but that still leaves us with a ton of space to roam around and have fun with.

My style of presenting him this game has become a bit less ... educational, I think. Mainly because there's only so much I can actually explain that matters within his natural horizon. I mean, for example, I tried to explain to him what 'corruption' is, but it was too complicated, naturally, since he's very young. We were focussing on having more fun instead and doing stupid things. Like .... in our current playthrough we tend to carry around a common brick, that my son gave the name "Carlotta", for reasons I don't know. But Carlotta is a thing now.

I was astounded by how well he memorizes things he has seen in INFRA .... starting with where we have to go next to continue, where some keys would be, things like that. Makes me think I have produced smart offspring.
Also things with actual relation to real life, like .... fire is hot, steam is hot aswell, don't go into deep water, don't touch electrical stuff or things go toast. I always avoid showing the "damage animations" the game has, but the dangers available provide me with the possiblity to point my fingers on actual real-life dangers nontheless. Some lessons learned.

I bought him his own flashlight and let him use the camera-mode of my cellphone to replay .... INFRA in real life, basically. He still does that, sometimes. Runs around, looking for things that are broken and acting like he'd take pictures. Super cute.
I also think that some of the ideas he caught up in INFRA were helping him getting a kickstart in kindergarten. He knows how to play like noone else does which made him interesting for the other kids. He also knows things that most others don't. He gets along well there.

Just so I have said it once again, since I probably have before, but INFRA is not the only thing in the world that he really likes. He seems to like dancing a lot for example and he usually sings something unless he's in a bad mood. It's just the only computer game I found so far that keeps him interested for longer than 5 minutes. Just like WALL-E is the only movie I found that would interest him, for example. Similar difficulty on that front, to get him hooked on other things on a screen.
For a virtual experience to catch him obviously things have to get some level of technicality .... and INFRA provides that, besides it being filled with many things that probably most children his age would be curious about, like trains and boats ... or our current favorite: The forklift. (Forget the red pickup I mentioned months ago. Noone like those anymore!)

Since he developed serious talking skills compared to last time I wrote in this section of the internet, I got the chance to actually ask him what he enjoys about INFRA the most. I mean .... I am now able to ask him detailed questions that he understands and is able to reply to in detail.
When asked, why he always wants to play INFRA when we play and none of the dozend other titles we've tried (latest flops were Forza Horizon and Minecraft on peaceful, by the way), he responded roughly like so: "The man helps. He repairs. He makes things better!"

That was an eye-opener for me and made me very proud as a parent, since all I want for him is to be the good guy in his own story which will be his .... life. It's good news that he likes to relate to good guys.
It's not always easy to teach moral values. So far I have not realized, that the protagonist in INFRA isn't the worst role-model to think of, from his perspective or even my own. It's subtile but maybe that's exactly the reason why it is so good.


I gave up looking for a replacement for INFRA by the way. I accepted my fate of having to play this game for the rest of my life and probably nothing else ever again with the limited time I'd have for playing games. My son is way too interested in it still for it to become too boring within the forseeable future and since my wife and I are having plans for a second child, by that time my son will have lost interest in INFRA, I bet you my second child will probably be into it. We're also young enough for a theoretical third. :D
Parenthood is always about sacrifice. Just like I drank my last drop of alcohol and smoked my last cigarette the day my woman showed me a positive pregnancy test, that is the little guy, that I'm raising now.
I really try to make the right decissions, I'm still somehow depending on good tools to do so and it is my duty to question my actions in order to become better at what I'm doing. Maybe that is why I say "Thank you!" more often nowadays, just like I did here.


I'm still thankful for the good work done by Loiste. Really great job guys. I'll be stuck in your game for the next decade or longer .... so I'm really glad you at least put a lot of effort into it and made it a good game! I'm still enjoying finding little secrets here and there.


Best of luck to you from a happy costumer (again) and a happy Christmas time! :-)

You may be able to find a cheap second-hand cellphone which will take pictures without being connected to any phone service. It might make a good present for your son, and allow you to keep your own phone.

Mark also has waterproof gumboots (Wellington Boots in some countries), and a hard hat. He would also carry a notepad or a voice recorder (another function of a cellphone ?) to take notes about what needs fixing. He also deals a lot with different kinds of keys and locks. Any of these might help introduce your son to more aspects of the real world.

I hope you don't mind that I've posted a pointer to this thread to the Loiste Discord, where the developers of INFRA and big fans of it will see it. They will be delighted to see a follow-up to your earlier post.

My best wishes for improvement in your, and your son's, health.

Dear Gottkönig,


Reading your messages has been wonderful. I have no children of my own, but I deeply enjoyed Infra and am glad that it is just as enjoyable for all ages. As you said, the fact that it shows the real world, but without needing violence to be interesting, is a rarity.

I wish you, your son, and your wife all the best. And when you do have your second child together, I hope he or she will enjoy playing beautiful games like Infra with you as much as your son does.

Please always feel free to share yoir experiences; they are a delight yo all of us.


Thank you, and best wishes!
Leira

This is beyond beautiful to read! How a stranger can make another stranger so emotional! Bless you all :)

Thanks for the input Pesky! He's really much into keycards, maybe I can do something with that. Ouuh, imagine I'd replace a keylock in our house with an actual keypad for keycards. I'll keep that in mind.
Costumes on the other hand are not so much his thing. We do roleplay sometimes, where I for example become him and he becomes me ... or he pretends to be a baby again or I pretend to be a dog and he can be my owner, telling me to sit and stuff .... but what flopped was when his aunt gave him a fireman suit and euipment for his birthday a few months ago. He liked the plastic axe, the whistle and the walkie talkie, but ignored helmet, vest and boots.
But yea, if his preferences ever change, you're idea is very nice. I actually wonder if he realizes that The Man is wearing a helmet. I'll ask him later tomorrow.

For Christmas itself I got him a toolbox with toy tools which is mildly related to INFRA, more to him helping me in the house when I have to do repairs and maintanence. He will love that, I expect.

Having your kid join kindergarten basically just means a lot of common colds. We're on our 4th at the moment since beginning of September, our son has fully recovered allready, my wife and I are in a bit of a delay.
I appreciate your wishes for us to recover fast and stay healthy. I wish you the same!


@Leira: Thanks for writing that.
I agree with you, that Infra has the potential for a broad audience. I haven't mentioned it here but lately even my wife joins our INFRA sessions, at least sometimes. There is this one riddle she always solved for me, even on my non-parental playthroughs, because I simply wasn't smart enough to do it on my own (it's the one with very many switches that have to line up correctly between 2 buttons and 4 gates in order to open a gate 3). I know it's optional, I still let her do it since it takes her 3 minutes while I can't do it in 30. That makes her feel good about herself and it is how my son and I are making her a part of it. Allthough most sessions still she uses to have time for herself, take a shower or watch some tv-show that neither me nor my son like.
At first my wife was sceptical by the way, that my decission to show a game was okay. She doubted our son was old enough. She gave me a chance and when it turned out that the game helped our son develop certain skills and knowledge aswell as take away some of his fears (spiderwebs, darkness,...), she changed her mind. Now she actively supports it.

There's many things you can show and teach and spend time on with your kid. Maybe one day you'll find out, who knows. :)
INFRA is a great thing to show and use to teach. With limitations of course, but that applies to everything. Too much of everything can be bad.
If we're lucky to have a second child, no matter if it's a boy or girl, I will introduce the new kid to INFRA aswell, when I see he or she is ready for it and could benefit from the experience.


In the meantime my son and I finished the Obenseuer part of INFRA which used to be his least favorite in our first two playthroughs and I'm now faced with the challenge of him having asked me what a turnip tastes like so .... I guess I have to buy one somewhere. No idea where. Haven't seen those in regional supermarkets. But I'll find a way.
He remembered exactly where the blue duck in the duck apartment was and actually told me.
For the first time he could figure out which little pipe to bring to Rob's apartment from the collection there is, which made me proud.
Having an automate in that chapter that takes old bottles and gives you cash for it also proved to be a minorly good influence. Guess, who's helping me with the tasks of doing that in real life :)



Sorry for the worse english today and possible other logic flaws, I have a headtache, but I wanted to reply to you people.

Have a nice Christmas time everyone, stay healthy and next time you play through INFRA and you're in the Obenseuer chapter, think of a little three year old who can't stop laughing about a car on the roof ontop of one of the building .... because apparently there's something insanely funny about that for small people. :)

Hi Gottkönig!


Turnips can be amazing, I have heard it is possible to prepare them in such a way that even a young child reluctant to eat vegetables will try them :)

Merry Christmas and New Year to all of you!

Leira

I thought about giving you an update. We're on our 9th playthrough at the moment.

And we're still discovering new things every playthrough. Like when just an hour ago at the end of the Chapter "Industry of the past" we learned that one of the ore off-shoots after the big diagonal elevator can be used as a slide for "the man". :D

Just last week we went with a new friend of him to a new playground we've never been to before. There was a rather large electricity building thing on that playground and it had an electricity warning sign on it.
When he and his new friend needed to, well, ... pee, my son told to the other little guy: "No, we can't do this here, where there is electricity! Electricity and water are dangerous!".
That statement made me really proud. He actually learned it from INFRA. He always asks me what warning signs mean, when we see them ingame. So when he saw the sign, it actually warned him properly because he was able to understand.

Aaaand, we're growing turnips in our garden this year :D .... we really did it. They're still tiny, nothing to show off yet, but the plants are looking fine. Looking forward on harvesting them and then maybe figuring out what to do with all the turnips.

We also bought a pipe system for kids for the garden. So he can attach pipes, run water through them, damage stuff on purpose and repair it again, which he likes a lot.

We're expecting a second son for late summer of this year. I'll definetly show him this game again once he has a certain age and I think he's ready for it. We'll see if he actually likes it or not.
With kindergartens closed and us in quarantine it was again a nice addition the classical toys and still a lot better than television to keep him entertained.

Also I finally learned how discord works and joined this game's channel.

Have a nice summer ya'll :)