Astro Protocol

Astro Protocol

Zachopotamus 21 Nov, 2025 @ 8:36am
Thoughts, a lot of them!
While I've said much of what I think already in my stream, I want to summarize and expand on my thoughts here for more people to benefit from. The game is in a fairly solid state right now and I enjoy a lot of aspects of it; however, there are definitely improvements and changes I would like to see.

I will admit that I'll most likely improve at the game with more familiarity of its mechanics and the ships, stations, etc., that are currently available, but so far I've only been able to win on the absolutely easiest difficulty level because the AI is so insanely aggressive. Though I understand that the developers' intentions are for the game to be very fast-paced, I found it to be incredibly overwhelming even as a veteran player of Civilization for the past 20+ years.

In my opinion, a big source of the difficulty lies in that it's incredibly easy for a faction to snowball but it's incredibly hard for a faction to recover once it's been kicked down. This inevitably leads to one AI taking out the other because it got better techs, ships, resources, and/or planets due to the randomized nature of the tech upgrades and map generation, then coming after the human player as hard as they can. (In most of my experiences so far, it was the Yimono Union AI that died, with one exception when the Santri were taken out early by the Raiders.)

Don't get me wrong, some RNG is a good thing. It can provide a lot of re-playability value to a game. However, too much RNG can feel unfair, especially when it causes the human player to lose or quit the game due to a sense of inevitable defeat. This is why Stellaris weights certain technologies to be discovered at certain points of the game, as without some of the key technologies in the game, a run simply becomes unwinnable.

Returning to the issue of snowballing, this is magnified by the lack of any mechanic in the game to punish a faction for expanding too large. While there is a degree of punishment for expanding too quickly from limited resources, it's easily bypassed by building more stations and stockpiling resources. This issue is compounded further by the way the difficulty settings work, giving the AI disproportionate resource bonuses compared to the human player, meaning even that simple punishment isn't even a factor for them either.

This problem would be less of an issue in a multiplayer game but this is a single-player-only experience at the time of this writing. Given there are no population mechanics or any way to make a smaller empire more viable over a larger empire other than pure luck on where resources have spawned and which technologies roll availability (with no option to re-roll, I should add), this really needs to change.

I think a simple answer is to add some kind of happiness mechanic for empires. The more an empire expands its network or the more planets it colonizes, for example, the more unhappy its people become (represented by the happiness resource), causing the empire to receive debuffs when in a negative value. A new kind of station that provides happiness or luxury resources/terrain (perhaps expanding on stars and why they come in different colors) could be implemented as part of this system to add more depth to the game.

As it stands now, I'm being swarmed so quickly by the AI (regardless of faction) on anything other than the lowest difficulty that I don't even have the time to research the more advanced stations that are available in the current build. Sometimes I'm not even able to unlock any new ships beyond the starting explorer unit. The pacing of the game is simply too fast and the technology availability is too random. How you can have plans to add more content to the game when it's nearly impossible to experience the content that's already there is frankly beyond me.

Regarding the issue of recovery being difficult, one of my biggest gripes is how incredibly easy it is to destroy another faction's colony. Just move any ship with at least one action point over an undefended planet and boom, colony destroyed, just like that. However, to restore that colony, the defending faction in the war would need to move a ship onto said planet and then sacrifice it (unless they can manage to get the special colonizing ship) to colonize the planet again. I think the game would be well served by either requiring a special ship to destroy colonies or by adding a timer before the colony is fully destroyed so that the defending faction has time to respond and save the colony. Or at the very least, require a ship to need its full action points to do it!

There should also be some way for planets to defend themselves for at least a limited time. In Civilization V and VI, for example, cities can bombard nearby units to damage them and have a defense value that engages the enemy units until depleted. Not having any way to defend the planet beyond stationing a unit on it when there's a limit of one unit per tile is not an ideal system and it's easy to see why Civilization didn't go that route when they switched away from deathstacks.

On this topic and the victory points system, captured stations absolutely should NOT count toward the stations needed to achieve victory points unless they are also inside the faction's network. It is way too easy for the AI to just send a bunch of units on a Genghis Khan-style map painting campaign across the galaxy and capture dozens of stations. Combined with the ease at which they can snowball, those captured stations will never be lost and there's no incentive for the AI to expand its network to secure them better.

Additionally, God help you if the AI allies with the Surveyors as they'll then see the entire map and beeline you like there's no tomorrow (if they're not already from finding you on their own). With no ability to engage in diplomacy of any kind (no peace treaties, no ceasefires, no alliances, nothing), the game lacks depth and seems to be trying to hide it behind a difficulty that's inflated by AI resource bonuses that are cranked up way too high, as well as AI that is so insanely aggressive it makes the AI in Civilization 2 look reasonable.

Expanding further on why I take issue with the extreme aggressiveness of the AI, the game does present a victory condition that isn't merely exterminating all of the enemies, i.e., the victory points. While exterminating your enemies or keeping them down through war can certainly help you to reach the required points, it's not actually required and it makes the lack of diplomacy options all the more puzzling to me. I'd really like to see the game changed so that it isn't a constant state of war or at least have an alternate mode like that, such as teams.

All of this said, I really enjoy the art, animations, theme, music, and many of the gameplay mechanics outside of those I've raised issues with. I particularly enjoy the anomalies and I was glad to read there are plans to add more. I just wish there was more time to enjoy the experience of exploration and discovering things about the galaxy before I'm fighting for my life with everything I've got. I'm looking forward to seeing the direction this game will go, as well as what the other three factions will be like and how their mechanics will impact the game as a whole.

I'm sorry if this all seems overly negative but I promise I would not have taken the time to write all of these paragraphs if I didn't think you had the workings of an amazing game here. I would really love to play it multiplayer with my partner and friends so that we can team up against the AI or even versus each other as well. Thank you so much to the dev who came by my stream and for the opportunity to showcase your game to my audience!
< >
Showing 1-9 of 9 comments
Zeikko  [developer] 21 Nov, 2025 @ 12:40pm 
Thank you for playing, streaming and sharing your feedback!

I will need to take some time to digest and test to see what we can and will do regarding your feedback.

But I've been thinking about making exterminating the planets little bit harder by requiring full action points as you suggested also. I will try that out soon to see how that feels.

I will also try making inactive stations not count on the station victory condition.

And as said I'll investigate how to give players more game settings to affect the pacing of the game.
Last edited by Zeikko; 21 Nov, 2025 @ 12:41pm
Ail 21 Nov, 2025 @ 2:10pm 
Hi, I feel, at least partially, responsible for some fo the experiences you are having. So I also want to chime in a bit.

First of all: This game is designed very differently from Civ so that finishing games within 1-2 hours is a realistic goal.

And the main way to achieve this are several of the things you heavily critique here:
The game is very snowabally.
The game has no artifical mechanisms to punish being ahead.
Each unit has the potential to be extremely valuable when it finds undefended stuff.

Now the point, that I'm responsible for, the AI:
I'm an AI-enthusiast who asked the devs if I can give it a shot to improve their AI, which already had a solid basis when I started. I convinced them by referring to my other works and flooding them with feedback about what the AI could do better.

I myself have about 200 hours in this game and since my own skill at the game grew alongside that of the AI, I kinda lost touch to what the experience for new players would be like. Players who don't know the in and outs of the game or the meta-strategies and who don't min-max of every single move.

The result is an AI, that beats inexperienced players to a pulp because it kinda plays like I would in a multiplayer game. There's still room for further improvement in areas like determining whether or not it's worth going for minors, focussing their attacks on ships or object permanence for enemy ships that leave their vision.
With many things of how they play I'm already quite satisfied: Their economical buildup is very solid, their resource-management is very solid, their movement-point-management of individual ships is also quite solid.

In order to keep up with them on normal difficulty, you kinda must do all of these things too. And in order to win, you must pair that with long-term-planning and strategical-decision-making which the AI is (still) kinda lacking in.

I know that many players are not used to an actually competent AI. So I guess the main-takeway here could be that the difficulty that is called "normal" might be relatively overtuned despite it being the one where the AI neither has an advantage nor disadvantage resource-wise. They also have no knowledge cheats or "beeline" for the palyer. They go for whatever territory is a different color than theirs and if they don't see anything like that, they aggressively scout for it by maximizing the amount of tiles they can uncover with the least amount of movement-points.

So using a lower difficulty-level as the default and maybe renaming them in ways that are not seeming like mocking the player when they lose on the lower ones, could be a way to go in that regard.
Zachopotamus 22 Nov, 2025 @ 12:17am 
Originally posted by Ail:
Hi, I feel, at least partially, responsible for some fo the experiences you are having. So I also want to chime in a bit.

First of all: This game is designed very differently from Civ so that finishing games within 1-2 hours is a realistic goal.

And the main way to achieve this are several of the things you heavily critique here:
The game is very snowabally.
The game has no artifical mechanisms to punish being ahead.
Each unit has the potential to be extremely valuable when it finds undefended stuff.

Now the point, that I'm responsible for, the AI:
I'm an AI-enthusiast who asked the devs if I can give it a shot to improve their AI, which already had a solid basis when I started. I convinced them by referring to my other works and flooding them with feedback about what the AI could do better.

I myself have about 200 hours in this game and since my own skill at the game grew alongside that of the AI, I kinda lost touch to what the experience for new players would be like. Players who don't know the in and outs of the game or the meta-strategies and who don't min-max of every single move.

The result is an AI, that beats inexperienced players to a pulp because it kinda plays like I would in a multiplayer game. There's still room for further improvement in areas like determining whether or not it's worth going for minors, focussing their attacks on ships or object permanence for enemy ships that leave their vision.
With many things of how they play I'm already quite satisfied: Their economical buildup is very solid, their resource-management is very solid, their movement-point-management of individual ships is also quite solid.

In order to keep up with them on normal difficulty, you kinda must do all of these things too. And in order to win, you must pair that with long-term-planning and strategical-decision-making which the AI is (still) kinda lacking in.

I know that many players are not used to an actually competent AI. So I guess the main-takeway here could be that the difficulty that is called "normal" might be relatively overtuned despite it being the one where the AI neither has an advantage nor disadvantage resource-wise. They also have no knowledge cheats or "beeline" for the palyer. They go for whatever territory is a different color than theirs and if they don't see anything like that, they aggressively scout for it by maximizing the amount of tiles they can uncover with the least amount of movement-points.

So using a lower difficulty-level as the default and maybe renaming them in ways that are not seeming like mocking the player when they lose on the lower ones, could be a way to go in that regard.
Respectfully, the game shouldn't be balanced around the experience of a single highly skilled player. It should be balanced around an experience that is going to be enjoyable for as many people as possible. The AI also shouldn't be programmed like it's a competent human in a multiplayer game because it just simply isn't.

If I want to fight against something with that level of intelligence, I will choose a multiplayer title instead. I, and many other people, don't want to waste our time getting our asses wrecked by overpowered AI. I've played thousands and thousands of hours of Civilization, I can't even beat the game when the AI has an income disadvantage, for God's sake.

On anything higher than the absolute lowest difficulty, I don't even have enough time to explore the map around me to decide which resources to exploit or get new technologies because they're just that aggressive. The game is over before it can even really get started and that is not a fun experience. It isn't a 1-2 hour experience, I'm lucky if I can even last 20 minutes.

I wasn't claiming the AI is beelining the player out of nowhere. I'm saying that once they do know where you are, exterminating you becomes their only goal and that's ridiculous when that isn't the only victory condition available to them. It's like they turn into Mr. Meseeks and try to destroy the human player as quickly as possible so they can stop existing because it's painful for them or something.

I'm not saying the AI needs to be braindead stupid. But it shouldn't be so damn smart and aggressive that someone who hasn't been playing this game specifically so religiously can't even do a damn thing in their first matches on even low difficulty levels. That isn't going to win fans or sell copies.
i cometh 23 Nov, 2025 @ 3:11pm 
Did you play on default settings? I played 3 (1 easy and 2 normal) and won 2 without feeling very overcrowded. I agree that the first couple turns are a little too impactful which means a rough start is kind of unplayable.

Honestly, purple feels a little too strong; colonizing any planet without terraforming is wild.
Last edited by i cometh; 23 Nov, 2025 @ 3:12pm
Zachopotamus 24 Nov, 2025 @ 8:39am 
Originally posted by Zeikko:
I will also try making inactive stations not count on the station victory condition.

I've gotten some more time with the game and thought about this point again. I realize now that would give an unfair advantage to the United Tellus, which is probably why you have it the way it is. Perhaps the required number of stations could just be higher.
Zeikko  [developer] 29 Nov, 2025 @ 1:20pm 
We released version 0.18 today with the following based on your feedback:
- Exterminating colonies on planets now takes 1 turn and the exterminator can not counter-attack while they are bombing the planet
- Inactive stations are not counted for the station victory condition
- Minor factions play more defensively so you will not be seeing their ships so early
- We have also renamed the AI difficulty levels and decreased the default difficulty by couple of levels
There are also bunch of other changes you can read more about them here: https://nullvectorstudios.com/blog/improved-extermination-new-game-settings-and-better-map-generation
Zachopotamus 2 Dec, 2025 @ 12:41am 
Originally posted by Zeikko:
We released version 0.18 today with the following based on your feedback:
- Exterminating colonies on planets now takes 1 turn and the exterminator can not counter-attack while they are bombing the planet
- Inactive stations are not counted for the station victory condition
- Minor factions play more defensively so you will not be seeing their ships so early
- We have also renamed the AI difficulty levels and decreased the default difficulty by couple of levels
There are also bunch of other changes you can read more about them here: https://nullvectorstudios.com/blog/improved-extermination-new-game-settings-and-better-map-generation
This all looks really promising! I'll definitely have to check out the new build.
I had an idea while playing your playtest build and wanted to make sure it got more attention by mentioning it here since I talk a lot about other things in the recording. There should be a terrain feature of nebulae, where moving through a tile that is in a nebula costs 2 action points instead of 1.

A terrain feature like this would help add strategic depth to the game regarding where you build up your empire as you could use it to slow down the advance of enemy ships or have to plan your invasion of an enemy empire around any nebulae that may exist within or near their borders. Perhaps ships could also be more difficult to sense somehow (not sure how that would work/be possible) within a nebula as a way to hide an incoming invasion force?
Last edited by Zachopotamus; 12 Jan @ 7:47pm
Zeikko  [developer] 13 Jan @ 5:44am 
Originally posted by Zachopotamus:
I had an idea while playing your playtest build and wanted to make sure it got more attention by mentioning it here since I talk a lot about other things in the recording. There should be a terrain feature of nebulae, where moving through a tile that is in a nebula costs 2 action points instead of 1.

A terrain feature like this would help add strategic depth to the game regarding where you build up your empire as you could use it to slow down the advance of enemy ships or have to plan your invasion of an enemy empire around any nebulae that may exist within or near their borders. Perhaps ships could also be more difficult to sense somehow (not sure how that would work/be possible) within a nebula as a way to hide an incoming invasion force?

Thanks! I like the idea and we actually have Nebulas already in our backlog. I made a proof of concept earlier about tiles that take 2 movement to move into and I liked it but it has some technical issues which prevents us from implementing them for the release. So we will not add them yet but hopefully in the future.
< >
Showing 1-9 of 9 comments
Per page: 1530 50