Yup, it should be changed.

Dude you don't even have 8 hours in the game and you want others to be nurfed because you suck? Instead why don't you practice more. It's fine how it is. And if you don't like the CTF map then change it. Some are for noob players while others are for more experienced.

If the level designer was able to set a max velocity for their level then they could shape the experience to suit their level.

This would allow a level designer to create a pure climbing map if they wanted. If players don't like pure climbing they could jus not play the map.

More choices for designers and players - a good thing.

While I agree with Spaz's sentiment I think you'll find that once you play the game for a while you will dial in your jump ability. The map design question is relative kind of by nature. If someone who hasn't mastered jump designs a level around their ability/experience it will definitely be exploited by people who are better at the game. I think nerfing better players would be a bad thing overall and designing maps to intentionally limit jump distance is the answer. I've made around 40 maps and have had to refactor a lot of them due to my own ability growing/hosting them to find exploits. TL;DR don't be salty bro, git gud.

No salt here, my post was a calm and well put together opinion.

No where in my post did I say I was failing at levels, the few times I am able to find servers I usually see People launching around the levels as if they were Superman, is that really how the game should end up being played?

I am a fan of Vicxvr's idea though, would make for more climb intensive maps as opposed to jumping maps.

Originally posted by SpazKoga:

Dude you don't even have 8 hours in the game and you want others to be nurfed because you suck? Instead why don't you practice more. It's fine how it is. And if you don't like the CTF map then change it. Some are for noob players while others are for more experienced.

These replies to my post are the real salt.

Hekinsieden I agree there's an opposition between climbing, where you interacting with things about twice your arm length away from you, and super jumping where you interact with things 50 yards away from you. Though maybe that's just part of the sandbox fun.

I disagree with Vicxvr's having the max speed be creator definable. It will make the "Climbey World" feel less consistent if its core mechanics change from level to level.

Currently jumping is a intuitive "player_velocity" = "hand_velocity". Setting a max speed makes this true only some of the time. This might... ruin immersion? make people motion sick? not do anything?

Maybe there's a answer to this where you can reduce someone's maximum jump velocity, and use the discarded hand velocity data to do some filtering to counter the "I flicked my wrist at the last second and now I'm jumping down instead of up" thingy.

I see what you mean about being part of the sandbox fun, instead of trying to push the game towards a certain playstyle.
For me though, I think I will stick to the normal non-CTF maps and simply climb in the way that I have fun instead of trying to meet the Flingey Meta.

Thanks for the reasonable reply themonkeyoverlordofsatin.

It's mostly not going to change because the big jumps are the payoff for people putting in lots of time, if I remove that I'm lowering the reward factor higher-level players get which just seems like a stab in the back to people that have stuck around.

I also highly enjoy being able to jump several factors higher than I would ever be able to in real life, it's fun. I'm not going to nerf fun.

Any other reasons have already been mentioned, Climbey is surprisingly unnauseating, if I start messing with its 100% physics based movement I may make it worse for some people.

Originally posted by ShadowBrain:

It's mostly not going to change because the big jumps are the payoff for people putting in lots of time, if I remove that I'm lowering the reward factor higher-level players get which just seems like a stab in the back to people that have stuck around.

I also highly enjoy being able to jump several factors higher than I would ever be able to in real life, it's fun. I'm not going to nerf fun.

Any other reasons have already been mentioned, Climbey is surprisingly unnauseating, if I start messing with its 100% physics based movement I may make it worse for some people.

Thank you for your insight into this ShadowBrain, I understand a little better which direction you are intending to take this game now.

Surprisingly good discussion :)

Games do have to please some people more than others; otherwise noone ends up happy. I do think the Flingey meta is pretty core to Climbey but I didnt actually realise it was a sacred cow type of thing. Well there is nothing wrong with that.

I commented on this post to wonder if the game could support other metas via the level design mechanism. My idea on maxxing velocity was not intended as a serious technical suggestion. I was only suggesting that other metas could be supported via map types. There are certainly reasons for and against and Shadowbrain has probably thought them through and arrived at his current position.

I can't comment for VR climbing purists because I'm not really a purist; I just play devils advocate for options cause I'm not the guy who has to code it up or manage fans of the game.

Love your work SB.

As for the CTF advantage. I wouldn't worry too much. Some maps will come that are designed to stop this (there's a few already) but for the maps where people can just do this the good players might be able to counter act that or people will find a way to "stale mate" this and it won't be an issue anymore :)

*One Month Later* So, not arguing for or against any changes, but I'd like to point out that the game "Echo Arena" has a similar "grab walls and throw yourself off them" mechanic, and implements a maximum velocity at which you can throw yourself off the wall. If you want to know what having a maximum like this feels like, check out this free game.

Yeah, it's the one thing I hate about echo arena.