Angels with Scaly Wings

Angels with Scaly Wings

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BlackDragon 16 Jan, 2021 @ 5:20pm
Bullet Math (Major ending spoilers!)
So, after seeing my first two endings, I find myself somewhat mystified by Reza's gun. It's a revolver, obviously, and those are traditionally - but not necessarily - six-chambered. You never get a good enough look at it to actually TELL, at least not that I've seen. What's strange is that depending on the ending, it seems to either actually be a FIVE-shooter, a six-shooter, or possibly even a SEVEN-shooter. Revolvers chambered for five or seven bullets obviously do exist, but... he's only got the one gun.

The issue, naturally, is the number of bullets that are fired at various targets during the final confrontation, and the way they add up. I just got Remy's 'good' ending, for example - in that, Reza fired one shot at the Administrator, one shot at Remy, then two point-blank at Maverick while getting chewed on. Finally, he put a bullet in the PC's back... and tried to finish him off, only for the hammer to fall on an empty chamber. That was five shots before he ran dry, if you're keeping count. I suppose you COULD argue that he might not have filled the revolver up completely after taking out Sebastian earlier, but that would be rather out of character for him, especially since we know from later events that he has at least two more spare bullets in his pockets. Sebastian was also shot at least twice, which - if we assume it's a six-shooter - means that Reza would have had to reload only a SINGLE bullet into his gun afterwards to make the math work out.

There are, of course, two ways to justify that: Either the gun's a five-shooter, as previously mentioned, or Reza just favors the 'cowboy load' - that is, leaving the chamber under the hammer empty in order to avoid misfires. Both of those, however, are contradicted by the FIRST ending I got - Adine's 'bad' ending. In this, Reza fires one bullet at the Administrator, one at Adine and three at Maverick as he's charging, before finishing off the heavily-wounded Maverick with an execution-style headshot. SIX shots in total, after which he threatens the PC with the revolver in order to escape. Of course, it's possible that the PC, considering his lack of military or police background and the general stress of the situation, didn't think to count the shots and thus conclude that the revolver being leveled at him is empty, hence not calling the bluff... but either way, that demonstrates that Reza's revolver can and indeed DO contain 6 bullets. Sometimes!

...now, I suppose I could've just put this spiel in the 'Bugs' section, but I kinda' wonder if there might be some possible, logical explanation for what's going on. I can think of ONE, possibly, depending on how this game's particular ball of timey-wimey stuff works, actually. My theory? It's a seven-chambered revolver, which actually adds up pretty nicely. A seven-shooter would carry a smaller caliber of bullets than a six-shooter, which helps to explain both how several dragons are able to shrug off multiple gunshot-wounds, and why the impact doesn't send the PC into immediate shock when HE is shot. If the gun was full at the night's beginning, and Reza used two shots to take down Sebastian, it would - by the time of the confrontation - house either five or seven shots, depending on whether or not he took the time to reload in between. Various minor, butterfly-effect results from your actions could influence this, by making him feel more or less rushed, more or less threatened. Hence, during a 'bad ending', he's reloaded his gun and can thus fire six shots while still having one left in the chamber to threaten the PC with, while in the 'good ending' he hasn't reloaded, and thus only has five - a fact he's forgotten about until the moment he pulls the trigger and it falls on an empty chamber. This, indeed, would ALSO explain why he's got exactly two bullets ready in his pocket for a quick reload later.

Any thoughts? Am I on to something, or just trying to come up with a justification for an obvious bug? Do you ever get a better look at Reza's piece in some other ending, or hear anything about what he's packing? As I said, I've still only seen TWO of the many endings...
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BlackDragon 16 Jan, 2021 @ 6:12pm 
Originally posted by Wyvern:
Here's what I think. Reza's revolver is indeed a six-shooter, but he also has extra bullets/speedloaders. It is mentioned in some of the endings (or Reza encounters) in Chapter 5 how Reza has "six bullets". Recall the protagonist saying: "You've got six bullets for three people. Do you think you can really do that, Reza? Do you think this is worth risking your life for?"

Oh yeah, he does say that... which just makes it REALLY weird that he lets Reza bluff past him after firing six shots, seeing as there's no mention of reloads or speed-loaders anywhere in that scene. Also, it's worth mentioning again that the PC isn't a soldier or a cop, and has no apparent experience with firearms. It also seems perfectly believable that he wasn't informed of exactly what type of gun his predecessor was equipped with when he was sent through the portal, or alternately that he was informed of it in a fashion that did not, to him, translate into automatic knowledge of its magazine-size. He thus may merely be ASSUMING that Reza has a six-shooter, since that's the standard for revolvers, without actually KNOWING it - certainly, at the point when he makes that statement, I doubt Reza would be in any mood to directly correct him.

Still, either way, something has to be happening that the text just doesn't mention. Either Reza rapidly loading his gun, or the PC realizing that he's looking down the barrel of a gun that's still loaded after firing six times, thus learning of his mistake.
BlackDragon 18 Jan, 2021 @ 7:36am 
Well, I've seen a number of other endings since writing the original post... several of them have Reza running dry after 6 shots, as one would expect. Others give no clear indication of how many shots he has on the ready. I also found out that you could prevent Sebastian's death, which rather nullifies my theory about why he sometimes only has 5 shots.

I've also found one other ending where he somehow runs empty after shooting five times - Remy's Bad Ending. In this case, he fires once at the Administrator, once at Remy, twice as Maverick (point-blank), and then finally puts a bullet in your back and attempting to finish you off - only for the gun to click empty.

Remy's Good Ending - where Reza fires six times, doesn't reload, and still acts as if he's got a bullet in the chamber - CAN be explained by the PC just being too distraught to notice that Reza is bluffing him, despite having pointed out how many bullets Reza has mere moments earlier. But these two incidents are harder - since Sebastian can be removed as a variable, why would Reza, in these two exact scenarios, be caught with one empty chamber in his six-shooter?
What about Vara if I remember correctly ? :awswvara:
This one.... dies....
Last edited by Naggarock the graveship; 18 Jan, 2021 @ 12:37pm
BlackDragon 18 Jan, 2021 @ 2:06pm 
Originally posted by Naggarock the graveship:
What about Vara if I remember correctly ? :awswvara:
This one.... dies....

In Remy's 'Good' ending, you mean? Yes, but that scene explicitly mentions Reza reloading his gun before taking those shots. It even specifies him loading two bullets, at which point he fires two shots. So that part, at least, doesn't really affect the math.
Well that was 5 good hours . And for that part with Remy good and bad ending . I have possible solution and it concerns Sebastian . If i can say so :BL3Facepalm: , from a plot point of view , there are might be involved timelines we passed and in one timeline we prevent Sebastian death , it may sounds weird , but i think timeline here in both endings , account Sebastian death and deletes 1 bullet from it ( damn time tricks ) , but if we not prevent Sebastian death , im pretty sure we will see him again lying on the ground in both endings and the bullet count will be truly 5 , alas i cant check it for sure or was it 1-2 bullets , picture a bit tricky (but i think 1 ) . And alternate solution is unlikely true , but still possible . When we prevent Seb death , we find the suitcase with eggs , so maybe when he was at hatchery there are another possible death , victim unknown . 3 Очень не хотелось бы винить того кто создал такой сюжет и все же допустил мелкий пробел , который можно было и не замечать . Все мы делаем ошибки.... :SadNorb:
What kind of mind-blowing s**t did I wrote :spacemummy: +1 extra hour :BL3Facepalm:
Last edited by Naggarock the graveship; 19 Jan, 2021 @ 1:11pm
BlackDragon 19 Jan, 2021 @ 2:49pm 
Right... first of all, I've seen the dead Sebastian often enough to say, with certainty, that he's got at LEAST 2 wounds. There may be more that are unseen, but he's clearly got a wound in the chest and another in the next. So 2 bullets... which is why I came up with my crazy '7-shot revolver' theory to explain how Reza could have had 5 bullets left afterwards.

Second, the eggs are always there. Reza mentions them in several endings, REGARDLESS of whether or not Sebastian was there to get shot or not. From what I gather, you simply only notice them if you aren't distracted by the far more visible lump of dead Sebastian in the middle of the field.

The idea that Reza might be one bullet short in some endings because the timeline can't decide whether he used 2 to kill Sebastian or not is... interesting, but perhaps a bit silly. :P At least, there's no suggestion anywhere else that the timeline-altering shenanigans can affect physical reality. All other effects are purely mental - people remembering or knowing things they shouldn't, getting a 'bad feeling' about stuff and whatnot. The only physical artifacts of time-travel are the things you, the player, actually takes through the portal back in time.
Well we didnt find the answer =D :BL3Facepalm: . But i still think timelines involved here more than 50% , even with memory erase ( in one ending i was really surprised that our PC have THAT DAMN REVOLVER IN THE POCKET WHOLE TIME and he didnt realized it =D ) . BTW there another one unlikely solution . Ending where Izumi :awswmask: gives directions to Reza just to not change timeline and possibly may stolen from him that damn bullet xD ( with the way of punch by shovel i guess ) . Also i'm curious about 7 bullet theory , but i still believe there 6 and cant check it because I don't like to find fault with small things (i'm not a critic , i'm a seeker:crystaldragon: ) .
BlackDragon 20 Jan, 2021 @ 7:31am 
Well, like I've said a few times, there's really nothing to suggest he has 7 bullets in his revolver at any point - bluffing someone with an empty gun IS a well-established trope, it just seems a bit weird that the PC will fall for it mere moments after pointing out that Reza only has 6 shots.

As for endings when the PC pulls a gun, I'm pretty sure the 'Evil' ending is the only one featuring that, and you can only get THAT if you've already gotten one of the two other endings where he COLLECTS said gun after Reza dies. In other words, that is simply a case of him carrying the gun with him through the portal and back in time, same as he can bring the underground facility blueprints, the Ixomen Sphere, the blood-test results, and so on and so forth...
Then I can only offer the escobar axiom ( rus term ) . In addition i got that revolver in pocket after the very first time i played and it so called NEUTRAL ending
BlackDragon 20 Jan, 2021 @ 8:50am 
Yes, that's indeed one of the two endings that gets you the revolver, and the most obvious one by far.
Dawnsong 15 May, 2021 @ 9:26am 
The official comics suggests that the Reza gun is of the "civil war era", probably an Colt Army Model 1860. These have six shots.
https://angelswithscalywings.com/comics/50-61/
Probably Reza has reloaded after have killed Sebastian in at least one timelines, but indeed the writers did some errors to keep the shot counts in some pieces.
However most ending have little sense in how are written too, so...
Last edited by Dawnsong; 15 May, 2021 @ 9:30am
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