Originally posted by -|NFK|- Suicide Clyde:

Its too late in the game to charge a monthly premium, Bazaar is far ahead of what your contemplating offering for a one time donation and no recurring subscription.

Alright about Bazaar.tf and how everyones gonna go there and how their system is blah blah blah.

According to one site someone posted about 8 pages back, TF2OP gets about 17,000 visitors a day, serving almost 500,000 page views a day.

According to that same site someone posted about 8 pages back, Bazaar.tf gets about 2,600 visitors a day, serving just over 16,000 page views a day.

That means Bazaar.tf gets about 15% of the visitors as TF2OP
and only serves 3% of the page views as TF2OP.

The reason they have the one time donation thing still is because they do not get the same amount of traffic, or the same amount of donations to hit the income/tax issue that TF2OP has reached.

If my math is any good TF2OP is about 6.5 TIMES larger in visitors than Bazaar.


SOURCES:
http://www.statscrop.com/www/tf2outpost.com
http://www.statscrop.com/www/bazaar.tf

1: As pointed out many times, most people are smart enough to use an Ad Blocking software that prevents them from seeing ads. Also, ad revenue is never as much as you would think. My argument is perfectly valid. He can't support the site on ads/1 time donations alone.

2: Trade offers - Sometimes doesn't work, and most people still don't use them. I've had people in my friends list who added me for a trade but didn't let me know what they wanted for those few days. As I sometimes have multiple trades open, they could've added me for any number of things, so I couldn't send them a trade offer.

3: A bot can give you 25 extra trades listed on the site? And if you mean a bot to autobump your trades, that's against the sites rules, and frowned upon.

4: Donator service isn't illegal, you are right. But you are also someone who obviously hasn't read a lot in the rest of this discussion. The donator system is being taken down do to legal issues with accepting virtual items as a form of income. I'm not saying it's illegal to take donations, I was just repeating that some laws about income, and taxes, make it a legal hassle to claim virtual items as income. Tax/income fraud is illegal and can put you in jail.

5: My thing about going to jail was an attempt at humor. It is still valid that he is being more than fair by giving you 3x what you donated in the old service for the new service.

6: uhm...sure?

Originally posted by ViperNati0n | RIP TF2OP:

ha what a joke, so now its monthly subscription and ads. glad to see traders greed is rubbing off on trade sites.
happy i got out of frequent trading, everythings going downhill. without autobump you get shit all views as the trades become hours and hours unbumped. happy i only donated $1

Yeah, what a joke for someone to be able to make a living off of something they put a lot of time and effort into. I mean how dare he try to cover the cost/time it takes to maintain the site. We never had these problems back in the old days. Back in the 1800's farmers only grew just enough to keep their family alive, never tried to grow more that they could sell for profit to better their lives. And if they grew more than their family needed they just gave the rest away. /sarcasm.

It's really not that hard to bump your trades yourself. I like that method because if I can bump my trade, I know I'll be near by in case someone adds me for a trade. Making it easier for me and for them. It's kind of annoying to wake up and find someone added you, but they're not at their computer for a few days after that. But that's just me. Also, if you're worried about getting enough views, isn't that based on a form of traders greed (as you put it)?

As for the permanent/donator thing, everyone just needs to get over it. It may have implied it was permanent, but it was only permanent for as long as that system was in place. That system has been removed, and is being replaced with a new system. Your benefits where permanent for the donator system. No where did it promise that your benefits would roll over to any new service that was launched.

The donator system has been cancelled due to legal issues (as it's been mentioned), and now a Premium service is being put in to replace it. These are TWO different services. Two different products.

Sneeza is being more than fair by saying "Hey, you paid into the old donator service that we had to cancel so we wouldn't go to jail, so we're going to give you free credit on the new Premium Service at 3x what you paid."

Lastly, don't let the door hit you on your way out. (And btw, you'll be back, they'll all be back.)

Alright, it's been a while, I have to ask: WHEN WILL THIS ROLL OUT!?! (Autobots roll out?)

I am curious on the final details, and I REALLY Want to try having more than 10 trades and autobump.

Luckily I'm a white person living in the United States of America so $5/month is nothing to me, and I have easy access to all kinds of credit cards and paypal and such. 'MERICA!!

So lets do this sneeza, then maybe you'd have funds to add other improvements (Like how about a random trading card search feature like you have for hats/weapons/games? HUH!? HOW ABOUT IT!?! )

What he ^ said.

Originally posted by Sneeza™:

I know that Facebook use it for credits so it can't be that bad.

Oh you niave person. Anything that Facebook uses is evil. MUHAHAHAHAHAHA!

That being said, thank you for your update Sneeza.

Originally posted by Blue Screen of Dea†h:

Originally posted by hyorin (buying dota2 items):

Outpost makes shit load of money just by Google ads.

Don't talk about something you don't have any knowledge or information about.

That. Right there. As a person who has hosted a site or two I can tell you personally that Ads do not generate as much money as people would think. Especially with plugins like Ad Block.

The way I see it is thus: Sneeza can't continue to operate TF2OP on meager ad revenue, and dealing with virtual currency (Which causes a big tax/income headache to deal with). This is the only option that works for the majority of users, and helps keep TF2OP up and running (Maybe even running better). Yeah some of you lose your donater perks after a bit, but which is better, getting 3x what you paid for in the new service, or losing TF2OP as a place to do your trades? If TF2OP shut down, your donater status would mean jack.

@Sandulf: About point B. He's saying that like next time you're visiting your mom and dad, or a friend, ask them if they'd be willing to use their credit card/paypal to pay the site (Since you can login from anywhere), and you pay them back with cash, baked goods, blow jobs, whatever. He's not saying you should share your login information with them. Just have them there to enter the card details.

I think people have every right to act condescending towards people who can't afford $5/month if they meet these criteria:
1 - Have a computer that is capable of playing games.
2 - Have a steady internet connection
3 - Have time to spend trading virtual items.

If you meet all three of those criteria there should be NO REASON you can't scrap $5 together if you are that serious about trading.

For anyone who is a casual trader, 10 trades should be plenty. And it's still free!! Yeah you have to go bump your own trades, but that's not really that difficult. It also makes sure your trades have visibility when you're actually at your computer and can accept friends and such.

Originally posted by HusKy:

When is this going to be available?

I believe it was mentioned that it should show up in a few weeks..which in TF2OP time means Summer 2014.

True, not everyone has access to the gift cards/credit. I don't have all the answers....move to the US then? idk.

I've come to a new realization. For all of you donators who are unhappy with this and plan on leaving. You don't know how THRILLED I am about this. The less people with their auto-bumped trades, the more my free account trades that I manually bump will be seen!! Also when I go searching for stuff, there will be less auto-bumped trades that haven't been checked/replied to in weeks (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE). Good riddance!

1. To purchase TF2 Keys, save a few bucks, got to one of the various stores that sells a steam gift card (7-11, Walmart, Gamestop, etc), use it to buy TF2 Keys from Steam Market place. TADA! Also, I got plenty of refined from crafting/trading items I got from dropped. The longest it should take you would be 2.5 months to get enough refined from just weapon drops. BUT if you get a hat or something else then the amount of time would be less. Point is YOU can get more keys if you work at it. OH WAIT THIS THREAD IS FULL OF PEOPLE EXPECTING THINGS FOR FREE!! HAHAHAHAHAHA

2. I understand that feeling, but you are still getting something out of it in the mean time. Yes it's not what you expected, but it's not absolutely nothing either. If they are gonna charge $5/month for the premium service, and you donated 1 key, you get 6 months (ABOUT $30 WORTH) for free. I'd be thrilled to turn a virtual item worth $2 into $30 worth of anything.

Another thing about Credit Cards...you know if you save a few bucks you can go get a Visa Gift card from most stores? Which I believe you can put into Paypal?