Originally posted by 7 Metroid - tf2s.net:

@Sneeza, anyway to make important announcements visible at the top of every user "my trades", it seems the announcements only go to main index page reason I never saw that the rules had been updated. I never check the "http://www.tf2outpost.com/" / index.php page and I'm quite certain many users don't check it either.

This is a good idea. I support it. In fact perhaps global announcements should display on every page in tf2op until it has been dismissed?

Thank you for the response Sneeza. I understand the concerns and am grateful that you were open minded enough to rethink your position on the matter. On the note on bitcoin trades, it is kind of a niche with-in the cash trading community and it is a bit of a bother to sift though the people doing paypal transactions to find the ones trading in BTC or webmoney. Would you consider adding a sereachable item smilier to the real life money option for bitcoins and other forms of on-line currencies? Bazaar.tf/ offers that and I find it very helpful.

Originally posted by Pretendeer:

I'll try and get other admins to post here. I really don't know why this is against the rules.

Thank you :)

Originally posted by 7 Metroid - tf2s.net:

@Sneeza, any thoughts about it, I was banned for 12 hours because I had 3 old trades with the words "I accept bitcoins", also I never traded for money, bitcoins was an experiment but never completed a trade for it too. I'm a top 10 donor and the 9727th tf2outpost member and was never banned before this incident.

Where the old trades still open?

Originally posted by Potato:

I have to assume that allowing Paypal, but not allowing Bitcoin or Webmoney, is some kind of mistake that will be noticed and fixed soon. Traders are losing thousands of dollars a month from Paypal chargeback fraud.

SteamRep is getting about 300 reports of Paypal fraud every month - and this is supposed to be the safe payment method? I had enough of it and stopped accepting Paypal last year.

Worldwide, the total losses from chargebacks are over $2 billion now. This system is broken, the fees are ridiculous, and merchants are sick of it, that's why more and more of them want to use Bitcoin (and other saner payment methods).

Even Humble Bundle accepts Bitcoin payments now...

Yeah, getting charged back is what got me into bitcoins. What was annoying is the fee I got for being charged back was worth more than the items I was scammed out of.

Originally posted by Pretender:

I don't know why it's against the rules either....

It's great to see that an admin has noticed this thread, if you could help bring this to Sneeza's attention and get some sort of official response for why this was changed that would be greatly appreciated. As a trader I'm less concerned about the fact that its against the rules, and more concerned with why its against the rules.

Originally posted by eddy:

Originally posted by KGB Bunny S> Items for bitcoins:

How do you mean?

Paypal is restricted in Russia.

Your logic still does not hold up.

People in Russia can still use proxies, or hi-jacked paypal accounts to use in buying keys. Also, on Paypal, there is the danger of charge back, which you have no real defense over. Paypal MIGHT side with you in a charge-back, but its a real crap shot with historical evidence showing the odds are in favor of the scammers charging you back than the buyer. Restricting payment to a vulnerable system like paypal makes it more convenient for scammers, not harder.

In any case, any speculation on why the rules were changed are just that, speculation. We can't understand why the rules were changed until we hear so from Sneeza himself.

Originally posted by eddy:

only paypal=less russians=less scam

How do you mean?

Originally posted by Leonhard Euler:

I concur. Bitcoin was the only way that a no-rep noob like me was able to buy buds and keys a long while back. (Since no reasonable seller trusts any buyer to not charge back with paypal.)

I guess there's always tf2wh for bitcoin, (but they take a tiny cut of each transaction).

Yeah, I sold you some stuff back in the day if I recall.

I find this rule rather arbitrary, as under the current rules, even businesses that are identical to paypal, like amazon payments, are not aloud. I've heard one person theorize that paypal is forcing them to forbid mention of bitcoins and are threatening to no longer process donations for the site if they do not. That idea seems a bit far-fetched to me though. While paypal as a company are massive bell-ends, I don't think a trading site for a game would be high enough on there rader to care about.