Slay the Spire

Slay the Spire

The Spell Scribe
Ergnon 26 Mar, 2019 @ 9:05am
First Impressions/Feedback
I played a few runs with this character, and I really really like the concept! However, the current execution unfortunately doesn't feel like it does the concept much justice. Hopefully since it's a work in progress you're looking for feedback - if not, feel free to ignore my suggestions.

Since the concept is modular spellcasting, I think the cards should push home that combining effects yields better results than the sum of the parts. I have a few thoughts on that.

1. Arcane Barrier should definitely not be in the starting deck. The concept of the card is fine - strong spell effect with a drawback in the form of negative Spell Modifier - and it would have its place in the mod design if you chose to keep it, but I think that place isn't the starter deck. Due to its drawback, it's more effective play it and cast the spell before playing it and casting again, so the (as now) only modular spell component you start with performs poorly when you try to make a compound spell. This seems like it should be against the design you'd want. I'd suggest maybe replacing it with Freeze, which fits a similar role with a more vanilla feel, or even creating a new card for the starting deck. If you want it to be a Block card, I'd suggest something on the order of Spell Effect: Gain 4 block. Spell Modifier: +25%. That way it's as good as a Defend with Retain if you use it once, but if you put 2 on a spell before casting you get rewarded with 12 Block instead of 10, and it could synergize with other Spell Effects you pick up, reinforcing that combining modular elements is how the character functions.

2. Speaking of the starter deck: it could be better outside of the above concern. Since the character is about the modular spells, they should probably start with more than 1 card in that theme. Ideally several that shine when combined with themselves, each other, and other cards you'd get later. I'd suggest a card slot for a Thunder effect of some sort, as it's more proactive than Block, and gains more when stacked with itself. Maybe 4 Strikes, 4 Defends, 1 "Spell Effect: Deal 6 damage.", and 1 Spell Effect Block card as above?

3. Most of the modular effects just add to each other, but don't synergize much. I think that could be improved. For example, what if instead of a standalone attack, Ritual of Sacrifice was a card with "Spell Effect: Deal 7 damage. Spell Effect: If this spell kills a creature, heal... {as it is}"? Would give a similar effect but further build on the spell stacking feature. What about "SE: Deal 5 Damage. SE: Deal 5 damage to self. SE:Heal for 25% (or some tuned number) of unblocked damage dealt."? "SE: Deal 4 damage. SE: Ignores Block."? There's a lot of potential to reward players for building spells that are more than just (X+Y+Z)*N damage/block.

Anyway, that's my first-impressions ramble. I hope if you took the time to read it you found something helpful - I really do like the mod, and I'd like to see it be the best it can be!

Edit - initially was going to post as a comment but I was way over character count - I'm a bit of a windbag!
< >
Showing 1-7 of 7 comments
ComingVirus  [developer] 26 Mar, 2019 @ 11:05am 
Don't worry about being long-winded, as I tend to be as well. I'll respond to each of your points individually, and number it out like you did, but first and foremost: Thank you for feeling passionately enough about the character to do all of this in the first place! Left Click and I appreciate the input for sure, and it brings issues we may have considered secondary to the forefront. Like for instance:

1. Arcane Barrier has long been on our list of cards to address, but with the recent switch of how generation of the Scribed Scroll is set up, I agree that it makes less sense than it used to. The base deck has been a concern of ours for a while now, but the changes really exacerbated the issues with the card. It just doesn't mesh well, and it doesn't really feed directly into any obvious archetypes of the character unlike the unique cards of other characters.

2. This builds further upon our focus to iron out the rest of the class before really focusing on the starter deck. Left Click had a card originally filling that role of a Spell Effect: Damage card, but thought it was too powerful and removed it before I signed onto the project, but I've been gradually moving in the direction where I think adding it back, or something similar back, would be overall beneficial to the class.

3. The particular suggestion of Ritual brings to light a part of design philosophy I've brought to the table in StS, in that healing needs to be limited in use, and highly situational. The problem with adding it on the spell is the stored nature of it makes it significantly easier to use, which is something I'd prefer to avoid. Using a card like ritual should require careful planning, and a lot of risk if you don't draw it when you need to take full advantage.

Now, that exception out of the way, I agree there's a lot more ways to utilize stored effects in this manner, and I've suggested a couple of them as well (Such as a chain lightning type effect), and the only real limiting factor is the sheer amount of time and testing that go into their implementation due to having to completely modify the behavioral code of the Scribed Spell to take these new effects into consideration. We're also still heavily experimenting around with over all Class identity, and so things like the Spell Effect: Vulnerable were deprecated for not making a ton of sense at the time, this was back when you only got 1 Scribed Spell per turn and applying Vulnerable happened after damage damage was dealt, and we're looking at Poison for potential deprecation as well due to the already somewhat busy base nature of the class identity as it is.
Ergnon 27 Mar, 2019 @ 6:40pm 
Thanks for the quick and detailed reply! I appreciate your openness and acceptance of feedback.

As far as the Ritual suggestion goes, I see your point. I thought the tradeoff would still be significant enough if the card giving the Effect still exhausted, as it would then be available when you needed it but put you off casting your Scribed Spell until you could secure a kill lest you waste the effect. Maybe if you went that route it would help to not give it either direct damage or Spell Effect: Damage, increasing the required setup, but I respect choosing to avoid it on principal.

I admit I haven't actually done any modding in the StS sphere so I don't know how difficult adding such effects is under the hood. I also didn't realize there was a time when you only had one Scribe Spell a turn - I just played the character for the first time the day I wrote this first post - so I can see how some of the cards might have vestiges left over from that philosophy. I also think it's interesting - either that or making the Scribed Spell cost 1 Energy could help make it more beneficial to stack up more effects before deploying a spell than it is now, which is one of my current concerns. The latter would also allow cost-reducing Spell Effects, and potentially also strong effects with the downside of cost-increasing Spell Effects. That said, I imagine you've considered both those options and have your reasons for the current implementation, just a thought.

I'll be playing more of the mod and will continue to give you my thoughts as I go!
Ergnon 27 Mar, 2019 @ 6:47pm 
One quick note that I forgot earlier: you might want to change the text order on Focusing Blow. As it is now I thought the drained effect was also a Spell Effect - putting it before the Spell Effect: Gain... line would make it more clear that it's an on-play effect, as now I think I'm not the only one who would misinterpret it at first glance.
ComingVirus  [developer] 28 Mar, 2019 @ 1:11am 
Something interesting is, the Big Spell archetype (The one made to start building up a lot of Spell Modifiers and Spell Effects) remains the archetype I've played with the highest chance of completion for Floor 3. Admittedly, that could just be because I find that archetype the most rewarding, but the reward for building a spell that large is certainly there.

We've tried to maintain transparency on what we're changing, and you can see every update that has been made to the character through the Change Notes tab. Our most recent change took your initial suggestion to heart, and we redid the entire starter deck to better represent the breadth of effects the Scribe has at their disposal.

I appreciate the feedback that Focusing Blow could be more clear, I'll let Left Click know that it's current layout isn't clear at a glance.
Last edited by ComingVirus; 28 Mar, 2019 @ 9:22am
Adonan 6 Apr, 2022 @ 1:48pm 
I like this character, but I think it feels kinda off. Keep in mind I'm no pro-gamer, but I think the reason might be that the spell effects are usually separate from the upfront effects. Most of the time, while trying to weave a strong spell, I took more hits and debuffs than I have on any other character. 90 percent of my time was spent at ~20 health, saved only by the Light Barrier card.

I think this problem would be mitigated, if not solved, by making cards like Mirror Image, if that's the correct name (4 block upfront, then 4 block for your spell effect), baseline. It's weaker than the upfront blocks a lot of us are use to, but the payoff when you stack several of them to use against a powerful boss attack makes up for it.

I realize I could weave a block or damage, then use the scroll immediately, but at that point you're just playing the cards normally so the spell weaving may as well not be there. That's how I was playing at first, until I realized that the scroll is destroyed at the end of the turn, but the spell effects you stack carry over. I was through the roof when I began to imagine the possibilities.

Overall though, I like this mod. It's a very interesting and fun idea, and despite the trouble I'm having (apparently everyone else is a giga-chad gamer if they're all saying it's OP) I'm still determined to master and enjoy this character. It's one of the most unique characters I've seen on here, second only to the Wanderer. The furthest I've made it so far is the second or third floor after the first boss. If the mod is as OP as everyone says, any tips would be appreciated, as it's possible I'm just playing the character incorrectly.
Last edited by Adonan; 6 Apr, 2022 @ 1:55pm
ComingVirus  [developer] 12 May, 2022 @ 8:59pm 
I'm sorry I'm over a month late! There are a couple things with Spell Scribe that result in a better run generally. The first is knowing enemy patterns, and planning your turns around them. For instance, with the first floor bosses they often have a turn where they do a big attack, so saving a blocking spell until that turn can save a lot of damage. For the second floor, a lot of the scary fights are AoE, so picking up a strong AoE card (Like Conflagrate or Static Series) can make those fights far more doable. Card selection is also an intended strength of this character, with lots of ways of drawing into the pieces you're looking for in particular encounters.

I think the thing that will lead to the most success is paying attention to your front load. There are a couple cards that look somewhat disappointing at first glance, like Static Cage, that often feel like one of the best cards in class once you've played for a while.

All of that being said, I'd always be happy to stream a run or two of the Scribe for you! It's been a while since I've played, and it'd give me an opportunity to get back into the swing of things for a potential Showman balance pass.
Adonan 25 Apr, 2023 @ 3:05pm 
Well, I'm a year late, so you won't hear complaints from me. It's kind of funny because I too haven't played in a while, but the first class that came to mind was your Spell Scribe, and the comment I made so long ago, so it clearly left an impression. A lot of your tips make sense, and honestly make the character even more interesting, so I'll give them a try. Thanks, mate!
< >
Showing 1-7 of 7 comments
Per page: 1530 50