Hey Adamidius.

This is a long post.... Too long for my taste but I said I'll do it and I wanted to.

I am not one to review stuff usually because I always feel it require long testing (which most people don't really do). That being said I'll have to add I played as Protection much more than Retribution.

You did a good job of manipulating the engineer charge bar to the combo points system. Although this was suggested a long time ago[forums.runicgames.com].
You did a good job of making 2 different specs who are both rotation based and still feel a bit different.

I'll love the fact you can get all abilities at early levels and continue your playstyle accordingly. I don't think all classes should be that way. It's actually good there aren't many like this which keeps this one interesting when I do play it.

I'll start with the Retribution tree.

I don't usually play with 2 handed weapons but I am always willing to try something new. The 4 seconds rotations fitted the elite difficulty more than the veteran but that's a personal taste I guess.

It has great damage and some decent utility with breaking shields, slowing and knockback.
The finishers are excellent, and the character seems fun (moreover I have lots of buttons to push when I want to).
But as many said (and you as well) It's a glass cannon. I found myself running backwards quite a lot in elite, regaining health and getting back to the fight.

Sanctity of Battle seems fitting and every time I have a free point I gladly put it there.

The biggest problem I have with the rotation itself is speed of light. I found myself not using it as often as I wanted to in elite since I needed a sort of an escape mechanic and a 4 seconds CD meant it's not going to be always there when I need it. (That is "kinda" fine since currently Holy Wrath gives 0.4 charge = 2 holy powers instead of one [BUG]).
Moreover Speed of Light feels like having a longer recovery time after moving forward than needed.

I felt like Divine storm had a long CD for later levels of the spell. I think the CD could be lowered by a few seconds each level.

In order to be a bit more durable I found Retribution Aura to be... pointless and instead went to the Devotion Aura (losing one point of Sanctity of Battle at the end). The retribution aura seemed so much lack luster that I didn't even feel it was gone. I'd even prefer 5 more points in Sanctity of Battle than putting points in that aura. We'll talk more about devotion aura later - in the protection tree.

Avenging Wrath felt like a longer CD than necessary. Because of how damage works in Torchlight it wasn't really a 30% increase in damage (I never really got to 30% but that's the last point) like in WoW and it felt like a minor increase in damage and some spell which was less useful than I thought for the CD.
(The double line chance to cast Holy Bolt is intended I guess [double chance] but it seems like a mistake).

In general, even with the devotion aura I felt it lacks some dodge. If you think the damage is too much lower it a bit but the lack of much needed protection made it sometimes impossible to play and enjoy. Frustrating at times, especially when it starts with 0% damage reduction base as a melee oriented character.
The best thing about dodge... It's really not that great to have but it does add something :-)

BUG?
Crusader Strike strikes twice now. Intended and not in the tooltip or a bug?


In general. I had a nice time with it. I didn't feel it is better than other classes out there with a 2H in mind but it is different and refreshing. Keep it up.



And now the Protection tree

Mediocre damage is the name of the game ahh? :-)
As intended this character is sometimes frustrating to play alone. I actually stopped playing it alone because of it. But in return we get survivability... a bit too much of it... actually quite a weird set of abilities which seems more fitting for multiplayer than single player (which seems like the design here more than anything).

Let's see how it can get so overpowered at times...
My friend is playing Kensei from the Far East Preview. A "squishy" character and a glass cannon like your ret pala in many ways. Then again the Kensei has 30% reduction in damage base. Unusual but mote melee characters have 25% reduction base so it's not THAT far from others.
At our current level (50) I give him through Devotion Aura 21% DR and when I'm using Long arm of the law (LaotL) I give him another 20% (I usually use it for the rotation as well so it's not just for him and he usually has its buff) (Up to the last patch LaotL was giving the buff to others only. I'm not sure how it should work). That's a total of 41% DR... Let's add it to the 30% he already has and we have.... well 71% which is almost MAXED and he doesn't even need to care about DR on his gear at all... Actually he usually have more DR than me since using spells lowers the protection "30% base reduction" through Ardent Defender (and LaotL until last patch gave DR just to others).
It'll get to the point I'll give him 24% DR + 25%... That's almost 50% which even on a character with 0% base DR is... AMAZING.
That's too much. WAY too much DR to give to others in the expense of the paladin himself doing a bit less damage (especially with more than one friend). The paladin does not need to sacrifice much to give it... cast LaotL every 3-4 seconds in a fight (not the best DPS but quite a lot of DR) if he's prot and the aura once an hour even if he's ret.

The paladin himself gets 54% without doing anything and while attacking anything between 75% to 61% (if LaotL was used) and that's without gearing for it at all.
Is that balanced for the paladin? That's actually not that hard to check but I haven't done it yet... It might actually be balanced, really (since all Limoany gems and DR stat will be replaced with damage increase stats)...
Then again I'm pretty sure that it is unbalanced while giving it all to others as well. A bit of a tone down to the amount of DR it gives to others is in order. Even half of the amount of the DR it currently gives is quite a lot.

That's the DR part...

The healing isn't meant for the paladin much... Multiplayer in mind is fine but I'm not sure about a design goal here :P considering Consecration heal is for others only and Word of Glory is halved for the paladin himself. I'm not complaining. Even with half power it's quite good but again - quite powerful with others. This might not need a change if you tone down DR for others. The healing alone (one of which could easily fit in a rotation) are a great asset.

Consecration aggro doesn't work as far as I can tell. I know it's in the effectlist somewhere (named AGRO) but I'm not sure it's working... and not even close to 100 meters of course. I think this was a test of yours which just sticked there.

The DR part of Divine Protection seems rather pointless or just too much. Considering base at max level you only need 36% DR (and that's with empty charge bar and no LaotL use). It might be nice having for the low levels but once you get higher you use it for the charge rate increase and might not even for that. This isn't much of a damage/survivability increase and the basic O-♥♥♥♥ button is Divine Shield.
Divine shield has the problem of not really saving me in most cases I need it to. Since I usually die to DoTs or stuff on the ground (I didn't notice) which goes through absorb effect and the added DR doesn't do much (but that's my problem I guess). Nothing you can do since you can't grant total immunity in Torchlight.

Ardent defenders, if I'll use WoW terms, is boring. Beside the first point which gives almost everything you need from it. You level something which you don't really understand the point of. All I get from it is +%hp and +%physical armor... While I see the difference in hp between 44 points in the ability and 88 points it feels so redundant I usually add the points there when my friend and I rest in town (sometimes I even get to 6-7 points) and I barely feel a difference if at all.
In the patch notes it says Ardent defenders should give +10% to all damage +3% per Gives a base all damage increase of 10%, and additional 3% per charge of Holy Power. Total: 25%.
It actually gives +10% physical damage (or so it says) and +16% from the charge bar.


Ok ok... Is it that bad?
Not really. It's quite fun! LaotL is AWESOME... Especially since last patch (I might be wrong on this since I didn't notice it before the patch) you pull in your friends as well as the monsters... making it so fun killing them all in one place (Might not be fun for range classes though).
Combining with RF (which is of course great for AoE damage)... Great times.
Consecration looks great (LaotL as well) and although I feel a better particle effect on Avenger's shield will make it much better visually it is still fun to watch the shield bounce on so many targets :-) (although from my limit experience it doesn't give the right chance to break enemies shield... no more than observation so I could be wrong on this).
Shield of the righteous for single targets as well (so we got that covered as well).

It sometimes feel like lacking a mobility move (Like speed of light). I actually thought about losing 3 points in Ardent defenders and go for Speed of light (one point there) and change to 2H when needed to use it. That may even hold true for losing another 5 points for Flash of Light (Another big heal won't hurt and 5 less points in AD won't be noticed.




General things

About mana.
Will mana improve it, change it, balance it?
I'm not sure I'm convinced about it. I will not write the reasoning behind it all since it's long as well and this post is long enough. That's a topic on its own and you'll do what you think is right with it... Just remember that mana is usually used in this game to prevent spamming of one thing so you'll use more than one spell. Having CDs on all abilities (except shielfd of the righteous) is doing the same thing without mana.

I know this is not really something you should be wasting your time on but.... Auras are confusing during fishing... Now I know... it's silly... and I only fish "Secret" fishing places but ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ I SOMETIMES WISH I HAD AN AURA OFF BUTTON... I had to unload it... Thanks...

More testing is needed... probably... maybe at lvl 100 with high level gear both specs will feel truly great (I'm not sure I'll get there with ret though... prot - probably). I'll update you (hopefully) when I get there.

Until then - I'm having fun with a friend using your class. So feel good about it :-)
I know I do :P




I'm pretty tired and possibly forgot some things... (block on AD and stuff....)
Maybe some other times.

Have a splendiday,
Rotoou