This modifier value, what does it do exactly? I know there is a table somewhere that determine how much actions can improve or worsen diplomatic relations, like you could make it so that Dwarfs and Greenskins never improve their relation by setting the multiplier to 0, no matter how many common enemies they have. Is this what that is?

Good morning Flying Fox.

I believe the table that you are referencing is 'cai_personality_diplomatic_event_values_tables' , and there you may find a list of all possible diplomatic actions and the relation cost associated with them. Most races share the same set of values, but Dwarves and Tomb Kings have their own set of values.

Incidentally, I have lightly modified this table for the Dwarves and added it to the forthcoming update. These entries used to have the component ID of 'holds_grudges', but it has since been updated by CA to better reflect the standard diplomatic component and is now 'cai_diplomatic_dwf'. I have marginally increased or decreased diplomatic actions for the Dwarves, as they feel more keenly acts of aggression, of friendliness and trade.

As for the modifier value, it simply exaggerates the diplomatic effects found under 'Approve' and 'Condemn' when in the diplomacy menu, although it seems to work in reverse. 'Positive Attitude Multiplier' works against the 'Condemn', and 'Negative Attitude Multiplier' works in favour of the 'Approve'. It still isn't completely clear as to how exactly the mathematics work, as with all things CA and Total War there's a certain degree of obfuscation about the whole thing.

At any rate, the cultural relations table isn't too dissimilar from the vanilla experience. The curve has just been stretched out a little further for a greater range of diplomatic ratings from one extreme to the other. I will run several auto-campaigns of 100 turns over the coming days and make note of the outcomes. If it seems reasonable, I'll look to release the update next weekend.

Apologies for the verbal diatribe, I would rather be transparent about changes being made to the module. I realise that these additions may be edging away from the original scope of the mod, but I have longed to update the 'Diplomatic Affinity Overhaul' mod from W1 and feel it is a good time to do so. If folk are hesitant about the additions, I may just section them off and stick them in a separate mod from this one.

The way you describe it, it seems that modifier is what I think it is. If you set the modifier to 0, would it not prevent diplomatic affinity from rising or dropping?

Don't worry about the verbal diatribe. It's more important to be accurate than to be concise.

Almost, as it also affects the other diplomatic actions but I cannot make an exact note of the mathematics. By default, every relation has a positive/negative modifier of '1' in the vanilla game.

Example:

Greenskins have an attitude baseline of '0' with other Greenskins. They're completely indifferent to one another. The default positive and negative attitude multiplier is '1'. These interactions below remain the same on every game load, first turn playing as Grimgor.

By setting the positive attitude to '1' (default vanilla);

- Teef Snatcherz Approve Raiding '2'
- Teef Snatcherz Condemn Treaties '-2'

By setting the positive attitude to '2';

- Teef Snatcherz Approve Raiding '2'
- Teef Snatcherz Condemn Treaties '-9'

By setting the positive attitude to '4';

- Teef Snatcherz Approve Raiding '2'
- Teef Snatcherz Condemn Treaties '-30'

There is definitely something else coming in to play, but I don't have the time yet to properly find out where. I suppose there is some 'falloff' value working in another table, it may even be the 'cai_personality_diplomatic_event_values_tables' referenced above.


Setting the modifier to '0' for positive and negative would probably prevent the affinity/aversion from rising and dropping, but then I don't think that would make for a particularly fluid campaign experience. From the limited playthroughs I've had so far with my new changes, the cultural relations remain distinct from one another in a sensible manner, and that's really all I'm looking for. As far as I'm concerned, Dwarves, Skaven and Greenskins shouldn't ever be neutral with one another, let alone amicable.

Indeed, that is precisely how I thought it worked, apart from the exact math of course.

Setting the modifier to '0' for positive and negative would probably prevent the affinity/aversion from rising and dropping, but then I don't think that would make for a particularly fluid campaign experience.

Indeed, that obviously isn't a good idea. But the main point is that you can mod how easily certain races gain or lose diplomatic standing with each other. This is pretty huge, as it can change how strict your mod needs to be. So instead of flat out removing the option for alliance between certain factions, you can make it unlikely and more difficult instead. Allowing for a more subtle approach.

I like this idea :>