the "close to life" approach sounds good to me, the overall armor weight might shift to medium anyway, but it feels more immersive. The skirt doesnt have much in the way of metal plating, so why would it be heavy? right?

Originally posted by Vlad:

the "close to life" approach sounds good to me, the overall armor weight might shift to medium anyway, but it feels more immersive. The skirt doesnt have much in the way of metal plating, so why would it be heavy? right?

Hi Vlad, Thanks for the comment. Sorry I thought I replied to this. Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I think my next update might restructure things a bit to accommodate that approach.
Originally I was thinking to try match it to the way the game was structured, but stuff it. :D

Hey - got a few ideas if you want (I'm also a historian specialising in Ancient Greece so this is right up my street! :D)

A few notes on the history first. The Corinthian Helmet started to fall out of favour about the 4th Century BC because it restricted vision and hearing. So lighter types such as the Chalcidian, Attic and Pilos started to make their way in (Although they did not completely replace heavier types. There was a wide range of gear used). Armour wise, full bronze armour continued in use right through to Rome's takeover of Greece. However, it was largely supplanted by Linothorax (A leather, linen or felt composite). Unarmoured was certainly an option - usually for the most mobile troops (Ekdromoi or Iphicratid hoplites) or for the poorest hoplites.

A couple of other notes - the Kopis was not 'Spartan' (That's just a modern '300' thing). It was in fact used widely alongside the Xiphos and Machaira.

So, my suggestions would be the following:

Heavy: Corinthian Helmet, Bronze Cuirass with Pteruges (Those leather strips hanging down), Greaves (And you can even do arm guards, thigh guards and foot guards as these are historically attested).

Medium: Chalcidian, Attic or Thracian Helmet, Linothorax (With Pteruges), Greaves/Calf length boots, Arm guards.

Light: Spolas (Basically a high leather stomach belt), Pilos helmet, Boots, leather arm guards.

Weapons are easier. The Hand-Axe (Sagaris), Double-bladed Axe (Labrys), Sword (Xiphos, Kopis), Dagger (Parazonium), Pike (Doru or Sarrisa).

Just some thoughts off the top of my head. If you want to talk a bit more, feel free to friend me and send me a message - I'd love to contribute to this!

Originally posted by Brytenwalda:

Hey - got a few ideas if you want (I'm also a historian specialising in Ancient Greece so this is right up my street! :D)

A few notes on the history first. The Corinthian Helmet started to fall out of favour about the 4th Century BC because it restricted vision and hearing. So lighter types such as the Chalcidian, Attic and Pilos started to make their way in (Although they did not completely replace heavier types. There was a wide range of gear used). Armour wise, full bronze armour continued in use right through to Rome's takeover of Greece. However, it was largely supplanted by Linothorax (A leather, linen or felt composite). Unarmoured was certainly an option - usually for the most mobile troops (Ekdromoi or Iphicratid hoplites) or for the poorest hoplites.

A couple of other notes - the Kopis was not 'Spartan' (That's just a modern '300' thing). It was in fact used widely alongside the Xiphos and Machaira.

So, my suggestions would be the following:

Heavy: Corinthian Helmet, Bronze Cuirass with Pteruges (Those leather strips hanging down), Greaves (And you can even do arm guards, thigh guards and foot guards as these are historically attested).

Medium: Chalcidian, Attic or Thracian Helmet, Linothorax (With Pteruges), Greaves/Calf length boots, Arm guards.

Light: Spolas (Basically a high leather stomach belt), Pilos helmet, Boots, leather arm guards.

Weapons are easier. The Hand-Axe (Sagaris), Double-bladed Axe (Labrys), Sword (Xiphos, Kopis), Dagger (Parazonium), Pike (Doru or Sarrisa).

Just some thoughts off the top of my head. If you want to talk a bit more, feel free to friend me and send me a message - I'd love to contribute to this!

Good, ideas there. I am in the middle of making a spolas piece. I've just been a bit busy.
I did read that the kopis was more of a cavalry weapon and that the spartans favoured a smaller xiphos. But I was going off, what I think is some out dated info (I can't find it anymore) which said that the spartans were depicted to use the kopis as it was a "bad guy" weapon. Obviously it was their rivals to depict this.

I agree with the close to life but with some exceptions to priorize the badass look, currently

I'm thinking about the wooden shield which would have been better looking made by metal.

@Helios - Sounds good - gimme a shout if I can be of any (research) help. The kopis was indeed favoured for cavalry, as it had a chopping action due to the heavier tip (Xenophon's Peri Hippikes suggests this).

You are also 100% correct about the 'Spartan' Kopis. Basically, most of our extant visual material comes from ceramics, and Athens was the main centre of production. So Spartans were typically portrayed with a Kopis to emphasise their lack of honour (Which goes against much of our written evidence). However - you'll also find Persians shown with the Kopis for the same reason, so it's dubiously Spartan. In fact, just about everyone used them.

The Spartans are also rumoured to use a shorter Xiphos. However, the source is Plutarch, writing about 500 years after the Spartans were at their height - so it should be taken with a bit of salt.

Herios does have a good point about the shield. The whole 'Lambda for Lakedaimon' thing is actually a mediaeval (circa 900AD) construct of the Byzantine Suda. However, the contemporary sources (And quite a few ceramic images) show Spartans with a plain bronze shield, highly burnished. There's also some earlier lead figurines that show your average variety of shield emblems - no Lambdas though.

@Brytenwalda - Awesome sounds like a plan.
Steam really needs better like and reply options D:

Originally posted by Hérios:

I agree with the close to life but with some exceptions to priorize the badass look, currently

I'm thinking about the wooden shield which would have been better looking made by metal.

I would say we should have all options. No need to delete the wooden shields, just add a new metal one or many ones.

Hey really like the mod! Took the liberty of making a list, hope it helps :)

High priority :
- Pteryges (probably the most important part)
- Add more torso variants ex: linothorax, a bronze chestpiece with the shoulder clamps as seen here - >

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoplite#/media/File:Hoplite_armour_exhibit_at_the_Corfu_Museum_closeup.jpg

Low priority :
- Xiphos
- More shield designs

Looks like activity around this has largely fallen off... This mod is a fantastic edition to the game, and looks amazing.

Definitely some things I'd love to see added, but what's here is phenomenal. Hopefully it gets some more love soon :)