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Stellaris >  Workshop > Getglad188's Workshop > Pre-FTL Players Testing > Discussions
Pre-FTL Players Testing
Description Discussions5 Comments247 Change Notes
Kepos 31 Oct, 2020 @ 2:24am
Ideas and response
Yeah, I really appreciate that you re-activated this very fine mod.

Well, your idea about it might be different to my view, but we might have in common that it is a nice challenge to start pre-FTL and encounter a large and wonderful galaxy out there. In a picture, it represents our very own situation here on planet Earth.

My personal vision is to get to a system, where every single player, AI or human, could be decided for FTL or pre-FTL start. Either by the human in a singleplayer, by the host in a multiplayer for each empire or in a request for each human player to choose for himself on gamestart. The goal is to get an asynchronus game start.

I don't know, but do you probably know the Sci-Fi novels of David Brin and his 'Uplift Universe', where supremacist aliens search the galaxy to find pre-sapient species to somehow 'uplift' them into sapiens by forcing them into patronage? The earthlings are somehow special, as they invented FTL drive alone. That's the exact position I have in mind by giving the FTL/pre-FTL choice for each human player.

----

Direct comments on game mechanics:

- the fleets get damaged by only having the experimental drive, whithout using it, so they constantly repair, which prevents any upgrade order. That can't be the goal. I would accept the need to repair, after they used the experimental drive, but constant repair seems a bit too much.

Ideas:

1. How about to change the experimental drive into one that burns out by using it? That would invent a very new mechanic how to use it. It would be a oneway road for each science ship or armed fleet, until one starts building a starbase in the very next system.

2. The oneway-experimental drive from idea #1 could also be used to start a new science tree that might lead toward warpdrive instead of hyperdrive. This might get an exclusive decission, once the species get toward a given border of wisdom. The warpdrive is still in the game mechanics, albeit it is currently used as an addition.

3. There is very very little to do while the centuries pass through, when you wait for the next finished research to .... hopefully ... get toward experimental drive option. It might be good to get some minor techs to help filling the gap. Would be an idea to invent a fully pre-FTL tech that somehow leads to the base of the usual game start.
Last edited by Kepos; 31 Oct, 2020 @ 2:38am
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Showing 1-14 of 14 comments
Getglad188  [developer] 31 Oct, 2020 @ 9:29am 
Never read the series, but it does sound interesting :) Personally I've been going for more of a "The Expanse" kind of vibe, which was also what the original author was going for. Without giving too much away, I do plan on creating some other mods that, when used together, recreate something similar to that world, as well as a more fleshed out Primitive Player system with more techs, and starting more similar to how actual primitives do in the base game. But I'm pretty far from that at the moment. For now, there's a few mods that I've been using with this that I think help a lot with having stuff to do early-game. I use:

The Belt
District Overhaul 2

I also use Planetary Diversity, but not the planetary habitats since they all start with 70% habitability, which is too high I think for starting habitats on asteroids, molten worlds and such.

All three have been compatible as far as my own testing has been going.

And I think I missed in your original comment, when you say the ship's damaged constantly, is that as in even when your zooming around your home system? It's only supposed to damage the ship on arrival in a system, so currently the damage should only be per use.

The one-use experimental drive would be interesting, but for the moment I don't have much interest in re-developing a warp drive system, even using existing mechanics. I'm kinda focused on the whole expanse style thing and Primitive Players really.
#1
Kepos 31 Oct, 2020 @ 9:39am 
Originally posted by Getglad188:

And I think I missed in your original comment, when you say the ship's damaged constantly, is that as in even when your zooming around your home system? It's only supposed to damage the ship on arrival in a system, so currently the damage should only be per use.

Ah, yes, my homefleet is only hanging around my starbase and get constantly damaged and repaired, so any upgrade order will fail.
#2
Getglad188  [developer] 31 Oct, 2020 @ 9:49am 
Gotcha. I see that happening on my end as well now. Yeah that's not supposed to happen, but it seems to be firing the check for ship damage every month instead of on arrival. I'll get to work on that!
#3
Kepos 31 Oct, 2020 @ 10:19am 
Ok, thx for taking a look on the fleet issue.



Read your Future Plans actually and found it quite interesting. I've seen 'The Expanse' with the seperate factions in one system. Pretty interesting.

Colonize Everything might help to expand if you need longer to research the spacedrive. Somehow a 'one-city-challenge' from Civilization series.

Space is hard sounds very interesting to me. There was a mod, where you could have several factions/empires in one space system, I remember. Challenging, when you have to first win the election process, one way or the other, to unite your planet, before you can start planing outward.
#4
Getglad188  [developer] 31 Oct, 2020 @ 1:22pm 
So I've been looking at it, and I know where the issue lies. It's a trigger issue for the event that causes the damage. If it ever worked at all, it depends on a modifier and trigger that definitely don't work now. For now I've removed that particular flavor so the mod works properly.
#5
Kepos 12 Nov, 2020 @ 4:28am 
Some news about my own little pre-FTL setup project:

https://steamhost.cn/steamcommunity_com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2283866798&savesuccess=1


Found a guy that brought back warp drive and tested a setup to probably have pre-FTL empires use warp exclusively. Some kind of roleplaying. Unfortunately the warp drive isn't catched by pre-FTL. Probably this information gets you interested in the idea to think about bringing warp drive in exclusively for pre-FTL empires...

However, your mod works, no issues or bugs to report.
#6
Kepos 19 Nov, 2020 @ 6:21am 
Further testings showed great results combining your mod with some other enhancements.

My latest test included Torus Ring 2.8 in combination with Gigastructual engineering and it's requested compatibility patch.

With this combination, I was able to pick Torus-Ring Origin start, which gave me the Torus Ring on day 2 and got me out of any material debt, so I could concentrate on research and design.

Together with PJ's Asteroids and Moon Habitats and/or Gatekeeper's Planetary Habitats one is able to play the full time until the FTL drive is researched. Otherwise it may get you a bit boring, only watch the timer run around, until you get the needed tech.

I would set those mods as recommanded for better pre-FTL experience or possible include them in your mod, if the other modders agree.

BTW, did you cut out colony ship from designs or is it a mod imcompatibility?
Last edited by Kepos; 19 Nov, 2020 @ 8:07am
#7
Getglad188  [developer] 20 Nov, 2020 @ 12:18am 
Hmmm... They should be designable. The regular colony ships anyway. The private ones I left out since you wouldn't be able to design them (since you don't own them per se. Is it the regular ones not showing up?
#8
Kepos 20 Nov, 2020 @ 12:32am 
Yeah, it is the ususal colony ship that is missing in the ship designs. I thought you probably bring them in later by research, so one has to build stations for colonization in-system.
It might be the RIG shipset mod that prevents colonizer for designs, no sure about.

As for mods, this time i combined pre-FTL with my MP2 collection, only changed SCM for Pantheon of the Void for a more RPG setup and cutted out Balanced Warfare 2.0 for RIG:Unique Shipset + submod. Especially the Ecology and Carrying Capacity do very well with it. The expansion is way more natural, as my home planet has it's own Torus Ring. I colonized nearly every single asteroid of Sol with PJ's mod, but when Gatekeeper's mod fired, I am not allowed to upgrade them, so on next attempt I will have to decide which one to keep. So the asteroids are only 1-slot habitabs plus 3 shadet ones that I am not able to clean by any means. Well, it gave me a fair trade, ressource and colonists income to start exploring the galaxy with the very first engine. Spreading out is like growing a tree, which seems way more realistic than the PDX way to grab-as-grab-can in Vanilla gaming.
Last edited by Kepos; 20 Nov, 2020 @ 12:32am
#9
Getglad188  [developer] 20 Nov, 2020 @ 4:23am 
Yeah it's definitely RIG that's doing it. It overwrites the 00_ship_sizes file which is where you can set ships to be designable. Interesting if it's only doing it to colony ships though... it should do it to constructors and science ships as well as far as I can see.

Other than that it seems to be working out well with other mods which is good to see!
#10
Kepos 20 Nov, 2020 @ 7:59am 
Well, most mods aren't inflected, but as for RIG it is. Now I started a round by exchanging RIG with Balanced Space Warfare 2.0 but got pretty much the very same issue. No colonizer in the designer too.

So, as it seems ship and battle-design mods do compromize pre-FTL, I'd politely suggest to think about a workaround on pre-FTL side, if that is possible.
#11
Kepos 22 Nov, 2020 @ 1:52am 
Err...just checked simply Pre-FTL and Balanced Space Warfare 2.0 + submods + patch with Irony Mod Manager tool. There was no overwrite / conflict with any civil ship, except some engine weights. Have to do a similar Test with RIG, but I guess the issue may be found somewhere else.
Last edited by Kepos; 22 Nov, 2020 @ 1:53am
#12
Getglad188  [developer] 22 Nov, 2020 @ 7:45pm 
Tested it with Pre-FTL and Balanced Space Warfare 2.0 (without any submods) and didn't have any issues. Colony ship showed up normally for me, which makes sense since it doesn't overwrite 00_ship_sizes. Could be in one of the submods that the issues lies, but Balanced Space Warfare itself seems to work ok.
#13
Kepos 22 Nov, 2020 @ 11:47pm 
Ah, nice, thank you. Probably I can fix it by load order, when I put Pre-FTL at the bottom.
#14
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