Counter-Strike 2

Counter-Strike 2

Rails
Lucy 3 Feb, 2015 @ 1:53pm
A compilation of my comments
Hey so I already wrote out an essay concerning this map and I don't feel like writing it again, but yeah.

Me and 9 friends decided to test this map in a 5v5 situation, so we played the map in a competitive setup, and some of the issues I noted with the map is that it is incredibly ct sided, despite how well made and realistic it is. As far as map control is concerned, CT's are offered all of it. It takes a CT half the time it takes a T to get to A (6 seconds for T as opposed to 3 CT) , and it's almost just as bad to get to B (11 seconds for T as opposed to 6 CT) if they're both running with their knives out. While this may not seem like much, it's offering CT's all the entry frags that they need, especially if they're using a sniper like the AWP. In fact, to get to the upper railings on B site it takes 12 seconds, which means that by the time a T gets to the main B ramp entrance the CT's will already have their scope on the choke point.


It takes 9 seconds to get from entrance to A, to entrance to B through spawn for CT's whereas for T's it takes 17 seconds.
(This has been addressed through a new T route)


A way to get around this (as seen in overpass which is also incredibly CT sided) is the uses of flashes smokes and HE grenades to break open the site, and although there are many ways for T's to flash into sites (A especially) the CT's can counter them with ease, using nade stacks on the vent for example. Mid control will be incredibly hard to take, if CT's use effective smokes, meaning that taking a bomb site from multiple angles is incredibly hard. It is also incredibly hard to fake the bombsite you intend to go to because of the lengthy map rotations, and the fact that the map encourages aggressive CT sided play (if they don't see anyone on the bombsite they can easily push and take more map control and wait for the T's to pass).

In my opinion this map is very similar to cobblestone, intended to be very hard to take a site and also very hard for the CT's to retake. However due to the excessive amount of nades it will take and the fact that because of map size T's will generally have to commit to whatever site they choose, it will actually still be incredibly hard for T's to hold the site after they've taken it, having to rely on their aim ability and holding angles, while CT's from the other bombsite can easily flash and smoke into the site to give themselves even more of an advantage.

As far as halves go, we lost first half as T 12-3, then won second 13-2. (Nova 4 - LEM)

I would love to see the map put into the competitive map pool, however only if it became slightly less CT sided. As for suggestions on how to do it, that's up for this thread to decide. If I were to suggest an idea, I would say T's need more map control to allow them to play a looser style of play. If T's could take mid easier that might help, perhaps remove the window at spawn so that CT's have to choose how they take it, which should slow down the rotates from CT's as well, rather than having a CT play at spawn and then only have to run for a max or 6/3 seconds to help support his teammates.
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Deh0lise  [developer] 8 Feb, 2015 @ 3:15pm 
Thank you for the feedback. This is what I've done for the next update (not yet uploaded):

1- Created a new route in B (http://imgur.com/a/iW9p0#0). The bombsite can now be approached from different angles without crossing mid, which is accessible from B. Rotations for Ts will improve. CT's rotate from spawn in 10-12seconds (look cover spots above), while Ts will rotate from middle B to upper A taking the stairs in 14 seconds, while rotating from mid A takes even less.

2- Moved T spawnpoints forward to balance encounters. These are the current times:
A up: 8s T, 6s CT
A down: 10s T, 8s CT
A mid: 8-9s CT

B main: 10s T, rails 7-8s CT
Mid B: 8s T, tunnel 8s CT

New mid route (breakable wood): 12s CT, 8-9s T

About the other arguments you've raised:
-You can kill the CT in spawn by aiming from different angles (on the orange wheelcart, close to the fence, boosting over the wood...). Despite it is possible, it was not intended to make it easy for Ts to rush middle, it is just open enough for Ts to control reinforcements.

The same applies for the CT in rails looking main B (ramp), as a T you can kill him from the inside of main ramp or going outside, that can give you an advantage. Look for the smoking guide I made if you prefer to smoke him. Also, once Ts are on the bombspot, CTs lose the advantage as the angle is lost past the train so they have to uncover themselves (move over catwalk, stay within a narrow tunnel).

- The commitment to one bombsite is true to some extend, despite it will be lesser with the new route. Despite that, it is something pretty common in many maps like de_mirage, where you have to risk a lot in middle to rotate or take a very long route from base.

In that regard playing smart with reinforcements in middle @rails may be interesting, not just when faking but even attacking, the faster (but riskier) route both for Ts and CTs is in middle, while the safer ones take more time.

The same way you may distract some CTs to kill reinforcements when attacking, you can do to achieve some boosts in both sites (windows @A or breakable wood @B).

-Once the bomb is planted there are some spots meant to work as holding areas for Ts: http://imgur.com/a/iW9p0#3 Where you stay and where you aim depends on how the round is being played, but you can obviously see there are some easy to control spots there with few angles.

Bombsite A is meant to be harder to plant but easier for frags (wider, different heights...), so it is usually more played when no strategy is involved. Bombsite B on the other side is easier to plant (once you get behind the train they've gotta uncover) but has harder angles to work with, so requires a bit more of teamplay (CTs can control with more ease the entrances with an awp).
Last edited by Deh0lise; 8 Feb, 2015 @ 3:16pm
Deh0lise  [developer] 15 Feb, 2015 @ 8:14am 
Update is up and running! Thank you ^^
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