Arma 3
Dynamic Camo System
Change of Colour intensity regarding the system
As a lot of people have mentioned in the comment section, the division of the worth of colours as camo isnt quite right yet. As for example, the colour black gets way too much praise as a camo colour, but in reality, its really bad. Its really only working when its completely black, otherwise you will be creating a big silhoutte. So that means, the colours that work best for an environment at day, it would also mean they are the best at night. Also black shouldnt get that much camo at day. Things like multicam should blend way better with grassland or multicam tropical with forrests. I know this mod is in an early phase, but those are definitely aspects that have to be reviewed. Also, the seperation of colours in a camo plays a big role, i dont know exactly, but perhaps someone later on in this discussion can explain. Thanks for the mod, really good idea.
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Showing 1-14 of 14 comments
ThomasAngel  [developer] 1 May, 2022 @ 5:56am 
There is no division of the worth of colours in the mod, nor are the things like camo patterns and colour distributions considered. What the mod does is just compare colour average numbers in RGB format and based on how much the averages match, applies a coefficient.

For example, if the ground average colour is [17, 21, 15] and your uniforms average colour is [32, 42, 30], then the averages match rougly 46%, which is then turned into a coefficient like so: 1.1+(sin((0.46*pi)-1.57)/2), which results in a coefficient of rougly 1.03.

So, as I've explained in the comments, there is no bias for black clothing built into the mod and the (alleged) effectiveness of black clothing is just a result of this calculation, and I don't see anything wrong with it personally, nor do I know how to go about changing it.

You can also disable night compensation in the settings, if you desire the coefficients to remain the same regardless of time of day. Cheers.
Last edited by ThomasAngel; 2 May, 2022 @ 6:45am
Cryptic 1 May, 2022 @ 1:34pm 
I think the people freaking out about black clothing are being a little much. It doesn't matter all that much. Black clothing is going to be hard to see no matter what unless in snow which will make them have a high visibility. I get that woodland camo should be better than black in the woods but a slight bonus in black is going to be minimal and fine in the long scheme of things.

The game is about realism. Not everyone should be wearing black. Use some discretion
outwardpanicjoe 1 May, 2022 @ 5:36pm 
Originally posted by Corrosion:
I think the people freaking out about black clothing are being a little much. It doesn't matter all that much. Black clothing is going to be hard to see no matter what unless in snow which will make them have a high visibility. I get that woodland camo should be better than black in the woods but a slight bonus in black is going to be minimal and fine in the long scheme of things.

The game is about realism. Not everyone should be wearing black. Use some discretion
this is true the best solution right now is just not to use black clothing but tbf where black clothing becomes problem in more modern combat is with night vision as most black dyes make black op out with a neon like glow out of the back ground like you wearing bright orange.
Nexogamer401 2 May, 2022 @ 10:04am 
Originally posted by Corrosion:
I think the people freaking out about black clothing are being a little much. It doesn't matter all that much. Black clothing is going to be hard to see no matter what unless in snow which will make them have a high visibility. I get that woodland camo should be better than black in the woods but a slight bonus in black is going to be minimal and fine in the long scheme of things.

The game is about realism. Not everyone should be wearing black. Use some discretion
well if black and Multicam tropical come before Multicam in an environment such as displayed in the screenshot, then there's something fundementally wrong with the calculation. It'll take time to adjust it.
Seb 2 May, 2022 @ 3:39pm 
unfortunately i have to agree here
something is wrong with the way things are being calculated atm

there is no point in using this mod if players wont be able to visually tell what works and what doesent by looking at the uniform and comparing it to the terrain - currently thats not the case

example: woodland and black outperform arid patters - in an arid environment

nobody wants to run around with a debug console all the time to figure out which camo works

if a pattern that should clearly be better than solid black isnt, there is something wrong with the maths
ThomasAngel  [developer] 3 May, 2022 @ 5:34am 
Originally posted by Sebastian:
unfortunately i have to agree here
something is wrong with the way things are being calculated atm

there is no point in using this mod if players wont be able to visually tell what works and what doesent by looking at the uniform and comparing it to the terrain - currently thats not the case

example: woodland and black outperform arid patters - in an arid environment

nobody wants to run around with a debug console all the time to figure out which camo works

if a pattern that should clearly be better than solid black isnt, there is something wrong with the maths
https://imgur.com/a/tIKrs06 Looks to me like the arid patterns almost glow against the ground texture and the M81 fits right in.
Nexogamer401 3 May, 2022 @ 8:34am 
Originally posted by ThomasAngel:
Originally posted by Sebastian:
unfortunately i have to agree here
something is wrong with the way things are being calculated atm

there is no point in using this mod if players wont be able to visually tell what works and what doesent by looking at the uniform and comparing it to the terrain - currently thats not the case

example: woodland and black outperform arid patters - in an arid environment

nobody wants to run around with a debug console all the time to figure out which camo works

if a pattern that should clearly be better than solid black isnt, there is something wrong with the maths
https://imgur.com/a/tIKrs06 Looks to me like the arid patterns almost glow against the ground texture and the M81 fits right in.
Ah I think thats one of the problems. You aint gonna be looking at it from that angle, so it will look different, but looking at this i still think MTP would blend the best. Hmm, perhaps there would be an option for several types of things that factor in the calculation. So lets say that grass/bushes get priority, then comes ground. You think something like this would work or is it only done by the colour of the ground?
ThomasAngel  [developer] 3 May, 2022 @ 10:53am 
It might be possible to factor in near by vegetation etc, but it might get costly on resources and it's not really something that I am interested in implementing right now.
Nexogamer401 3 May, 2022 @ 12:13pm 
Originally posted by ThomasAngel:
It might be possible to factor in near by vegetation etc, but it might get costly on resources and it's not really something that I am interested in implementing right now.
Any idea why the darker colours get so much points? I know how the system works, but the ground colours arent that dark, are they? Might be worth taking a look for the reasons.
ThomasAngel  [developer] 3 May, 2022 @ 12:29pm 
Originally posted by Nexogamer401:
Any idea why the darker colours get so much points? I know how the system works, but the ground colours arent that dark, are they? Might be worth taking a look for the reasons.
The ground texture average is pretty dark. Checking the debug info on the texture in question reveals that the RGB average is [56, 53, 40], which is pretty dark. Perhaps there are a lot of colours in the texture that go against each other so that the average ends up being dark?
Nexogamer401 3 May, 2022 @ 12:34pm 
Originally posted by ThomasAngel:
Originally posted by Nexogamer401:
Any idea why the darker colours get so much points? I know how the system works, but the ground colours arent that dark, are they? Might be worth taking a look for the reasons.
The ground texture average is pretty dark. Checking the debug info on the texture in question reveals that the RGB average is [56, 53, 40], which is pretty dark. Perhaps there are a lot of colours in the texture that go against each other so that the average ends up being dark?
So the whole map is calculated? Maybe opt for just the area around the person. I dont know how much performance that would take, but i dont think much more.
Cryptic 3 May, 2022 @ 1:01pm 
Originally posted by Nexogamer401:
Originally posted by ThomasAngel:
The ground texture average is pretty dark. Checking the debug info on the texture in question reveals that the RGB average is [56, 53, 40], which is pretty dark. Perhaps there are a lot of colours in the texture that go against each other so that the average ends up being dark?
So the whole map is calculated? Maybe opt for just the area around the person. I dont know how much performance that would take, but i dont think much more.
agreed. after playing with the mod more, i decided to ditch it. not accurate enough
ThomasAngel  [developer] 3 May, 2022 @ 2:02pm 
Originally posted by Nexogamer401:
Originally posted by ThomasAngel:
The ground texture average is pretty dark. Checking the debug info on the texture in question reveals that the RGB average is [56, 53, 40], which is pretty dark. Perhaps there are a lot of colours in the texture that go against each other so that the average ends up being dark?
So the whole map is calculated? Maybe opt for just the area around the person. I dont know how much performance that would take, but i dont think much more.
No. The only thing calculated is the texture you are standing on, so there is no "calculated area". If you move from a green texture to a white one, the coefficients will change.
Nexogamer401 4 May, 2022 @ 1:11pm 
Originally posted by ThomasAngel:
There is no division of the worth of colours in the mod, nor are the things like camo patterns and colour distributions considered. What the mod does is just compare colour average numbers in RGB format and based on how much the averages match, applies a coefficient.

For example, if the ground average colour is [17, 21, 15] and your uniforms average colour is [32, 42, 30], then the averages match rougly 46%, which is then turned into a coefficient like so: 1.1+(sin((0.46*pi)-1.57)/2), which results in a coefficient of rougly 1.03.

So, as I've explained in the comments, there is no bias for black clothing built into the mod and the (alleged) effectiveness of black clothing is just a result of this calculation, and I don't see anything wrong with it personally, nor do I know how to go about changing it.

You can also disable night compensation in the settings, if you desire the coefficients to remain the same regardless of time of day. Cheers.
Well i dont know on which basis you are working on there. Those two colours are both almost completely black and you wouldnt see much of a difference there, so the match of 46% isnt really possible there. What might be the case it that you combined the 3 numbers in the code first and then ran an average check, which wont really work well. What should be done is that Red, green and blue should be checked before. I think youre probably checking the difference and dividing it with a number to see how far they are apart: 1 being the worst. Id say you should check all three colours for their difference and then divide each by 255, which is the max RGB value. After that you could combine them again by summing them them up and dividing by three. I would say that is the less complex, but more accurate way to do it. Would be cool if you could explain your thought process by your current calculation. Guessing youre viewing the 3 colour bases as edges of a triangle and going from there. Might be fine, but i dont think it has to be that complicated.
Last edited by Nexogamer401; 4 May, 2022 @ 1:15pm
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