So far, so good.

I'm on the opposite side of most (internet?) opinions. I like it when weapons kill stuff. Sure, we could make all the guns do one damage and all the mercs have one health to make it a 'real man's challenge'. We could also play a campaign with just pistols.

But I get sad when weapons become obsolete just because another exists.

Assault rifles, submachine guns and pistols become obsolete almost immediately because sniper rifles exists.

Why use assault rifles when you can use less AP killing stuff with a sniper rifle? It's usually one shot kills. Meanwhile, I can unload an entire magazine from an assault rifle, and the dude takes it like I just used a BB gun, and even fires back. It's... not so immersive and makes many weapons in the game a false-option.

But I don't like just using sniper rifles. I like AKs, ARs, pistols, SMGs, knives, etc. I like diverse options. I even use hands sometimes.

So, if it's a touch too strong, that's not so bad. It keeps the weapon relevant throughout the game, which I like.

Also, if they are a touch too strong, then they probably stack up against sniper rifles better, which helps you if you like trying out different guns (and who doesn't, right?).

It's not so much that sniper rifles need to be nerfed. IMHO, all the other weapons need to come up to the sniper rifle's power level, or at least get a little closer.

So, "a touch too strong" is probably just right for everything except the sniper rifles. On the other hand, sniper rifles being stronger really doesn't matter as much because they are already one-shot weapons. What's more powerful than one-shotting something?

So, while I haven't encountered the M134 yet, I'd suspect it's fine. You can already one-shot just about anything with most sniper rifles. If it's paying an appropriate amount of AP to one-shot stuff (not too much either), then it's not so different than any other sniping rifle.


TAR
I have an issue with the TAR. It always fires full auto for interrupt attacks. Four interrupts later, the weapon was at 66% and ready to possibly jam on my next attack.

That was by Turn 2. A lot of fighting to still be had. But I had to sideline the Merc because it looked like his TAR was about to fall apart. I never used it again because I avoid weapons that will fall apart mid-battle. It's not very immersive.

There was no rain during that fight either. If there was, I believe it would have dropped down to 33% with just four interrupt attacks. They start jamming around 50%, I think. Maybe 60%.


VSS
Recommendation; The VSS could not be cumbersome. That seems a little overkill. I basically don't use any cumbersome weapons. I'm not a fan of losing speed to replace one one-shot weapon with another one-shot weapon.

Otherwise, I'm digging the mod. I used to mod JA2. I'm the one who added the SL-8 to JA2. It's nice to see it included here. Cheers.

I'm curious as to why the C96 is behaving like an SMG, with the ability for full auto fire and run and gun. I'd be okay if it was just a higher-range version of the hi-power. Now it seems like an Uzi on steroids.

I do really like the STG having mobile shot though, gives it a neat niche.

I should probably seperate the Weapon into normal C96 single shot and M1932/M712 "Schnellfeuer" with Auto-fire, i agree

Could be a weapon modification?

Good point, but a variation would be nice too, allows to allocate the same Model as a different weaponclass. I will probably replace the c96 with a better model in the future and when i do i will seperate it into 2 variants

Thank you! I noticed the tweaks. Good stuff.

Thought/question

Can the cumbersome trait just be turned into a higher AP cost?

After thinking on it some:
- My above complaint about the cumbersome trait is probably niche, but maybe others play the same way as me.
I get both speed upgrades for all my mercs as soon as possible.
I max out the free move.

- But that means the cumbersome trait affects the way I play more significantly.

It's disproportionate to me because it just lops off a whole group of weapons I just don't use.
(Things I want to play with, but can't, if that makes sense).

I don't mind the armor being cumbersome. There is a clear pattern to it. And I feel a clear trade off by equipping my mercs with lighter armor and accepting that when they get shot, they take more damage. Simple. Clean.

I don't like the weapons being cumbersome though. It's somewhat arbitrary even in the vanilla version. Some guns are big and have the cumbersome trait. But then others are technically bigger and heavier but don't have the cumbersome trait.

It feels bias even. (albeit, this is really a complaint about the vanilla game, not this mod).

All of this is somewhat just my pedantic thoughts. I'm absolutely enjoying the game and your mod. It's glorious to have all this JA stuff back. But I do feel like the game would be better if the cumbersome trait only applied to heavier armors and not the weapons.

And if the heavier, cumbersome weapons just required more AP, then I feel like that would be fine. It would also then affect all mercs the same way. Less management grit, but IMO, that little bit of management grit doesn't relate to anything fun (for me, at least).

Caveat: The minigun and other truly heavy weapons could keep it. Mortar system aren't something you quick draw. That type of stuff makes sense with the cumbersome trait.

But then, I'm not exactly using my mortar specialist to make 'fast' flanking maneuvers either. At least, not like my gunners/skirmishers. It's not that type of weapon.

So, thoughts for a future mod...? Or, maybe another modder see's this?

Cheers either way. Great mod.

love this mod so much ! hope you will add a grenade launcher to AN-94 i mean theres so much space for it the gun looks like it wants a grenade launcher just saying lol

Balancing looks pretty good overall, one thing I noticed however is that the HK33 is...too good to be true. It is significantly better than the G36, which is arguably down to the Leooptics which you can combine with UV- and Red-Dot...and the G36 being wrongly limited by its vanilla attachements that should be significantly better than they currently are. Not to mention that the HK33 also has longer range and higher damage for the same AP costs. This leads to the HK33 being (in my opinion) the single best 5.56mm assault rifle right now.

Just from what I know about both rifles, the HK33 has a shorter effective range than the G36 despite the higher bullet velocity, mainly due to the worse recoil.

On the G36 vanilla attachements being essentially "wrong", the standard set is a combination of a reflex sight with 1x magnification and a telescopic 1.5x sight (for the export models, German Army gets 3x mag as standard). Which means the G36 would actually need to have its Sniper x5 attachment reworked to be the standard attachement it comes with and it would have to give essentially the same bonuses as the Leovision attachment for the HK33.

I know you are not intending to change vanilla weapons but outside of nerfing HK33 (and somewhat HK53) I don't see a way to make any vanilla 5.56 assault rifles viable.

I guess you are mosly right here, and i would extend this to the HK23E as well.

Part of the reason why it is like this is probably due to me putting a lot of work in those particular models and allowing a very high level of customization, wich most likely led to me beeing a bit generous in regards to the stats to make the guns desireable and the time i spent on them worth it.

That beeing said, i will revisit them soon and re-evaluae their stats.


Did you try the new F2000 ?

Have just purchased the first one, will test it out on my tertiary squad.

Amazing mod, and for me there are 2 things I think you may have a look at:

1. CAWS from the shotgun family just overpowered. It has a crazy range, high accuracy, and high damage, I don't know if my merc is too strong, but my merc with CAWS in his hand is just like firing AR with shotgun shells.

2. I really like the idea when you put a lot of old rifles like Type 56, SKS and others, but i feel like they are all the same from the perspective of stats and they are all worse than vanilla winchester 1894, I really wish you can buff them a bit at least to the same level as winchester 1894 and make them a bit different from the perspective of stas.

I agree with both things, although for the CAWS its literally ment to be that way. The CAWS is ment to be overpowered and feel crazy. If you ever used it in JA2 you know what i mean :D

Your second point is more complex and true as well. I will have a look at Item stats and Balancing.
The Vanilla balance is a bit problematic with for example G36 and Winchester 1894 beeing way too strong imho wich causes logical inconsistency in the overall balance of vanilla and tog combined

Really enjoying the mod so far, thanks for your incredible effort!

One thing that I'd like to see changed would be gun noise radius.
Noise radius in vanilla especially for snipers was the no 1 reason I stopped my first playthrough mid game. It's game breakingly easy to get silent kills with snipers imho.

TOG improves this quite significantly, but for my personal taste the values are

1. still quite low (using mp5s and mid game not seeing any reason to use subsonic ammo at all; knifes get obsolete way too early)
   
2. too close together to make smgs valid. Don't see much reason to use 9mm ammo in my silenced MP5 with a 14m radius instead of using my silenced m16 with 16m radius. At 20m range you can already get insta headshots with the M14. I think long range (+ insta kill hs) guns should be so loud, that it gets super tricky, next to impossible to find a position on the map from which to fire it unnoticed. At least the ones you fund until late game.

Also I just found an M82, that starts at 22m noise range and you can get it to 9m with a suppressor. That's probably not per intenton, right? :D

Hey SkunkXL,

Still using this awesome mod.

I really like the lower APs for the pistols. I'm actually using them again, even in the late game. Cheers!

It's such a nice quality of life detail because most just become parts-fodder almost immediately. And there are so many options that I would love to use (if they made more sense to use).

I have a modding question.

I want to edit some more pistols to have lower AP. This is in relation to other mods too, so it's a little more intricate of a question than just modifying your weapons specifically.

If I edit -
C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Jagged Alliance 3\ModTools\Src\Data\InventoryItemCompositeDef

Will that just get overwritten the next time your mod gets updated?

Same question if I edit from the in-game mod editor. If I use the in-game mod editor, will it get overwritten later if you update your mod?

Thats amazing to hear Hachiryoku, what a wild ride :-)

Did you also see the revolver freeswap item? its also present one some small smg´s. Swapping to those particular weapons is always free because they are so small.

Running your own local version of the mod will generally have quite a few strings attached, but once you did your edits you stop receiving the updates, as your local version is favored.

So you can safely edit the Guns and adjust them to your liking without fearing the next tog update will whipe your changes. worst case is you gotta open and save your local version in the modeditor :)