Total War: ROME II - Emperor Edition

Total War: ROME II - Emperor Edition

Temples of Desert Cultures
NorPhi 8 Dec, 2014 @ 1:23pm
About Arabian Godness
I'm terrible at modding, but at least I can help you researching...

The german wikipedia articles about pre-islamic arabian mythology is kind of more comprehensive (while the english articles of the godnesses are better sometimes)...

They hab a whole pantheon and already whorship Allah but as ruler of all other gods (similar to Zeus/Iupiter). Cult sites often started as holy areas (ban on killing animals) which i would suggest as basic building using the babarian basic temple icon. They had a lot of minor gods but the three godness I named were like SUPER popular amoung most arabian tribes. Also interesting: They were thought to live in rocks.

Al-Lāt (translates "Godness"), Herodot compared her with Aphrodite Urania, some other sources compare her to Astarte (punic) or a mesopotanian godness of the underworld, I'm not sure but lets say that she was a love AND war godness (similar to Astarte) because some arabians used her idols/cult images as field sign/signum. She was said to live in a white stone. I would suggest using the icons of either Isis or Astarte.

Al-ʿUzzā ("the strongest") was the godness of the morning star (the planet venus) and also compared to Aphrodite Urania by greeks (-.-). She was said to live in a red stone but also in three samura trees (this refers to several species, most likely umbrella acacia). I would suggest using the icons of the Endovelicus (iberian).

Manāt ("Fate"), sometimes also Al-Manāt was the godness of the evening star (which by chance happens to be Venus, too) but at least greeks were more creative in comparing Manāt to their own gods. They said Manāt is either Tyche, Nemesis or both. She was believed to live in a black stone. I would suggest using the icons of Tabiti (nomads, aka. Skythians).

Hope that will help. I will translate them as soon as (I realised that) you update your mod.
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Showing 1-6 of 6 comments
Javi_Wan  [developer] 9 Dec, 2014 @ 12:51am 
Thanks, it is really very good info. I will be working in the new temples as soon as i can
Javi_Wan  [developer] 9 Dec, 2014 @ 1:44am 
I will follow your advice, and due to the descriptions, I think i'll give Al-Lāt an administrative effects bundle, Al-ʿUzzā, a farming and order bundle, and Manat a war bundle
NorPhi 9 Dec, 2014 @ 7:31am 
In middle age Islam the concept of predetermination and fate was (maybe it still is?) very strong. It probably already was a strong feature in acient pre-islamic arabian religions. Therefore I would move the administrative bundle to Manat (authority is determinated by fate) and give Al-Lat something seemingly odd like bonus on income through cattles and moral-bonus at recruitment for soldiers... something that highlights that she is a complicated godness of different aspects (like Astarte).

Fun fact: The greek Aphrodite Urania, the roman Venus and the punic Astarte they all are linked to the planet Venus. They sure hat a hardcore crush on astrology in this age...
Last edited by NorPhi; 9 Dec, 2014 @ 7:32am
Javi_Wan  [developer] 10 Dec, 2014 @ 3:44am 
Ok, i'll swap effects. I think i'll have a new version today ready to test.

Edit: its out, and its seems to work. Could you help me with the temples tooltips?
Last edited by Javi_Wan; 10 Dec, 2014 @ 4:17am
NorPhi 10 Dec, 2014 @ 4:29am 
Sure. Let me check the files quick.

*Researching*
Last edited by NorPhi; 10 Dec, 2014 @ 4:41am
NorPhi 10 Dec, 2014 @ 6:34am 
Ok, everything which is already present in the vanilla game I would simply reuse without addding anything new. Just set the key of for the description to the description of the vanilla temples.
For the remaining tooltips I would like them to tell a story. Just a few thoughs about the cult of this temple.

I renamed the Berber factions basic temple from shrine to Wüstenaltar (engl. desert altar) in my translation to prevent upgrading a shrine to a shrine (of someone) this sounded more like a specialisation than an upgrade... But the tooltip would be the same something which stats that in acient times (megalith culture) they sacrifices to the moon and the sun. Even if they stopped doing this these cult sites sure stayed important.
Example: "An acient cult site where moon and sun where honored by sacrifices."

The berber death cult buildings (tombs, tumulus pyramidal tombs) are new, right? In this case I would suggest something that points out that berbers worshiped they ancestors and believed them to become gods. I assume you know about the nubian pyramids[en.wikipedia.org]? If you don't plan in adding other temples for Aethiopians/Nubians I suggest you enable them in building a 5th level temple by upgrading any of they 4th level temples (royal cult or death cult) and using the skythian 5th level temple icon.
2. "Human fear dead. - Is it the end or just a new beginning?"
3. "If death is just a change of state. The soul itselt must be immortal."
4. "Even the deads need homes - bigger ones of the corpse was rich before."
5. "A grave of a sacred king. Immortal by power and fear."

Arabians:
Holy site as I said, this was an holy area. They were called "ḥiman", det. "al-ḥimā" (copied from wikipedia. I thing det. means determinative, I'm not sure how to use this). The gods forbid killing animals and evey animal grazing in this area belongs to the gods. This sure contradict to their bloody sacrifice cults. The stones of Al-Uzza and Manat were said (by greek historians) to had turned red respectively black as result of the arabs habit to brush them with the blood of their sacrifices (I think they meant sheep or other cattle but Punics were said to sacrifice children by romans and the bible said similar things about other tribes, so maybe....).
Maybe we should just reuse the tooltip of the babaric nomad 1. level temple. In german it's something like "A place touched by gods emits a aura of power.".

Al-Lat
2. "Al-Lat, godness of love war."
3. "It seems odd but remeber: love itselt is the war of hearts!"
4. "History is full of men fighting wars over the favour of a woman..."

Al-Uzza
2. "Al-Uzza, the morning star, harbringer of the Sun."
3. "Every morning rebirths the sun; every morning exiles the cold of night."
4. "Al-Uzza was called for protection. In war as in peace."

Manat
2. "Manat, the evening star, mistress of fate."
3. "Believing that fate is the will of a deity is a common thing amoung humans."
4. "Reign is determine by fate. A leader is well advised to pay respect to these gods."

I also would suggest to add a 5th. level temple as upgrad of any of these three temples: The Kaaba. Now one or even THE most important sanctum of the Islam, the Kaaba reaches back to the very beginning of all abrahamic religions and maybe even further. Wikipedia stats that the acient Kaaba was covered in symbols representing the myriad demons, djinn, demigods or simple tribal gods and also was an oracle of Hubal the Main god of Mecca. Al-Lat, Al-Uzza and Manat were said to be worshiped there, too.
Kaaba
5. "An acient oracle and cult site of a myriads of deities. Which later in history will become the inner most sanctum of the reign of a single god."

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Note: If you add the 5th buildings, please don't overpower the cultural conversion I would love to see myself in the dilemma of preserve a foreign temple because of it's boni or raze it to eradicate its cultural impact influences. Most desert nomad home regions have very high cultural tradition values. A plus 6 temple would be always something to demolish if they won't come with an extreme reducement of cultural discrepancies or high civil order bonus.
Last edited by NorPhi; 10 Dec, 2014 @ 7:51am
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