Total War: ATTILA

Total War: ATTILA

Kingdom Under Heaven: A Divine Ambition
Wiid  [developer] 18 Mar, 2016 @ 11:35am
UNITS EXPLAINED (No ones reading all this)

You maybe thinking "Man these units are weird, thier sizes make no sense", and you would be right, they are off because I'm trying to get them to play diffrently. Alot goes into what makes an elite unit better, not just Melee Attack. Take the Herculiani vs Elite Palatinas. Elite Palatina has almost double the Herculianis attack (62/35). But the Herculiani are more expensive and much better. They have higher health values and melee defense so they last in combat much much longer. They dont do all their damage up front they, do it by grinding the other unit down, not just killing them outright in seconds because they out DPS them. This leads to more combat time. Once morale for the Elite Palatina starts to wavier as they take losses from their low durability, all that attack skill is meaningless.

Trying to copy that concept. I want my elites to be smaller but tougher. I want to do about the same damage (Serjeants/Knights). Its deciding what you want and whats needed. Do you want more attack power? Get Serjeants there increased numbers will help them flank more and give them better charges. Do you need durability? Get Knights their insane armor values makes them near immune to missle fire and thier high health and morale means they dont really care about thier losses as much and die and route much slower then other units. Even with thier decreased numbers.

You may think having smaller elites handie caps them but remeber you get larger lowier tier units to compensate. Together, with the ENDLESS build options thanks to uber roster size they equal up to being much better and more fun. Its just harder at the start. As it should be. Attilas AI is as easy as a point and click adventure game. Making the units HAVE to relay on each other to function at 100% just makes you care more about what units you have, where as before you just tech up to tier 3 and SPAM TILL THEY DIE, once you can afford to do so.

The point of this unit balance concept is that no unit goes obsolete. I didnt bust my ♥♥♥ making the largest roster ever just so more then 1/3 gets phased out as the game progresses. Thats Total Wars philosophy, not mine. Thier limited rosters doesnt really expand, so much as replace old units with new ones because as units unlock other ones become redunant in cost effectiveness or are simply disabled from the game after that. I hate this. I dont belive it should work like that. So I balance my units the way I see it. Each units gives advantages and disadvantages, when compared to each other. Each units has potential value in all stages of the game. I did my best to make it so that no units out preforms another with out added cost or weakness. All units are equally cost effective, all units have impact, all units have unique purpose, all units will ride eternal, shiny and chrome!

Also archer units are smaller, because I buffed Cav units. You cant have the best of both worlds. But mainly because the AI's understanding of ranged combat is pathedic, it never focus fires so unless your not paying attention, thier very rarely in any danger. So as to discourage just simpley shooting the AI to death, since it doesnt understand the concept of a creeping advance, which is dumb and boring. It also makes my ranged units more glass cannon-ey. With the fact that most of my archers have the same relative combat values and equipment as my infantry. If I gave archers the full complement of troops, why whould you ever by "swordsmen" if you just got archers (that have swords and shields) that come with an additional ranged option?

"The point of this unit balance concept is that no unit goes obsolete." If archers can protect themselves then they dont need protection from other units. If archers can flat out "Kill" other units with mass volleys, then they dont need the extra Cav to flank them and run them down. My faction PLAYS differently then others because it is not balanced to "WIN" in Attila. Thier balanced to "FIGHT" in attila. And to put it bluntly the AI is just to easily shoot to death. And thats an unintresting way to play the game. With all the Longbowmen and Crossbowmen it would be even easier for my faction. So they got hit by the nerf gun.

So I buffed Cav units to compensate. This makes flaking and positioning more important. They are more fun and intresting aspects of the game, and thematiclly their "Knights". Knights ride out an meet there enemy they dont cower behind the lines and shoot them from saftey, this faction needs to reflect that core value.
Last edited by Wiid; 20 Mar, 2016 @ 8:00am
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Showing 1-15 of 16 comments
SooSneeky 20 Mar, 2016 @ 5:02am 
Thanks for pointing this out, it explains alot :D
I have started on mainly using the archers to deal with pesky horse archers and general skirmishing as I feel this is the best way to use them.
Wiid  [developer] 20 Mar, 2016 @ 6:47am 
exactly there not ur main offensive weapon their a suppor unit as they should be
Last edited by Wiid; 20 Mar, 2016 @ 7:56am
Haibane 20 Mar, 2016 @ 7:08pm 
It's a good explanation but somehow i can't recruit them, i guess i have ti disable every unit mod because all mines have roman names...
Wiid  [developer] 20 Mar, 2016 @ 7:09pm 
yes
Argon 22 Mar, 2016 @ 8:12am 
One problem with your smaller size elite troops is that they don't hold very well against artillery, javelin, and tower. May I suggest to boost them to at least 120 men? They can barely beat other faction's top tier sword units in a 20 vs 20 fight. The siege battle is surprisingly painful. My elite units suffer heavy damage under enemy fire while my cannon fodder units route as soon as they engaged enemy. My range units could provide very limited suppress fire.
Last edited by Argon; 22 Mar, 2016 @ 8:13am
What is the best unit?!
Marcus Antonius 5 Aug, 2016 @ 5:39am 
thumbs up!!!
TheDarkDefender 15 Dec, 2016 @ 12:03pm 
Finally someone whom understands that spamming elite praetorian and Celtic archers is no fun. I really like the way you think an try to fiks CA's broken money grabs. Really like your mods an downloaded both others, an finally great name "Kingdom under haven" it gives the right feeling.
Wiid  [developer] 15 Dec, 2016 @ 8:01pm 
Thank you sir sometimes I forget people still play my old mods, I have to go back and update them soon but Seven Kingdoms keeps me super busy.
TheDarkDefender 15 Dec, 2016 @ 11:52pm 

Do you work on that, that's amazing. Already downloaded but I hope your're going to add more unites but I now you will. Thinking about all the work you do for use its really really great.
Half of my army is made of menatarms, the other half is sergents and a handful of knightly units like paladins or authorities (or those awesome warrior monks, always thought Europe needed those :P).

Perhaps you're about to say "doen't that mean half your army is made up of nonprofessionals?" Nope, way more. Because mind you, these nonpros get their 'eternal retirement' earlier as the sargents and knights fight on for way longer as the nonpros are replaced constantly. So waaay more nonpros than pros, just like a fuedal-ish army, or any preindustrial army SHOULD be.
Vanilla Attilla and Rome II have their nonpros phased out by superheavy spamming.

This mod does the game way better than the game does. It forces you to have larger swaths of cheaper armies meant to support the heavier, elite units. I've tried once or twice to raise knight armies, but they have such weak numbers that they're not even feasible. However, some knight-plenty of sargent-tons of menatarms armies fare overwhelmingly better than all menatarms,all knights, all sargents, or only a mix of the previous 2 armies. That's impressive to pull off. If you mix in all the special units such as the angelic soldiers to form an auxilliary, then you have a diverse and largely cohesive army. The diversity of units presents provides so many options to specialize or generalize your army.

Sorry for the long essay, but all in all, this mod does the game way better than the game itself.
Wiid  [developer] 31 Dec, 2016 @ 1:29am 
Wow at this point I honestly didnt think anyone would get how it was supposed to work so +1
Wiid  [developer] 31 Dec, 2016 @ 1:45am 
Trying to introduce new gameplay patterns is hard because I dont have much in the way of letting players know about them or differentiating them from the standard gameplay style other then numbers. Thank you for your post it means alot that some people can see what I was going for.
Alan 6 Jan, 2017 @ 12:57am 
Very interesting - Whats the lore? And the level of model qaullty
Originally posted by #The Rising:
Very interesting - Whats the lore? And the level of model qaullty
Lore - Basically theocracy, that and it makes European monastic monks warrior monks that you can recruit. They're not too good in a fight unless it's against cav, they tear cav apart, very specialized unit

Model Quality - Everything looks pretty damn awesome
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