RimWorld

RimWorld

Rimsenal - Core
Weapons in Practice
Hello there, I've run a few tests with the weapons from this mod and here's what I've found; this is pretty much a general overview of the weapons and how useful they really are in practice.

(Be forewarned, this is a really long but hopefully very helpful post. Allot of what I'll say is either confirmation about what the guide on google docs says or is unmentioned in said guide. In comparing weapons I'm trying to state how they actually preform in-game in combat as opposed to the guide's descriptions and just the stat numbers on paper.)

Yunhwa
These weapons are incredibly useful against soft-body/unarmored targets but are only better-than-nothing aside from the microwave weapons against armored targets. The best use for them is dealing with animal attacks, especially small ones, and putting down targets without killing them via bleeding and the resulting pain.
One of the best weapons here for the job is the Boreas/Swarmer, shots will continue to track targets and stay active even if a target leaves the gun's maximum distance after the weapon has been fired.
Microwave Grenades are fairly effective at disabling a target for capture but you'll really only want to use them if you don't have an Aurora Microwave Cannon.

The Ice Pillar Vibrosword is by far the best melee weapon at legendary quality, easily exceding a Plasteel Longsword and maybe the only weapon suitable against a mechanoid out of all Yunhwa weapons. I have mixed results comparing it with Jotun's hammer against mechanoids but it seems to do a better job only because of how much it can disable Scythers.

Yunhwa armors speciallize in speed over most of everything else, your pawns will move much faster and be more protected but not more so than the other armors. The Nervesuit will greatly decrease weapon warmup time and greatlty increase pawn speed but lowers the player's accuracy. Unless your pawn is a champion shooter and/or has stuff that enhances accuracy, using this armor isn't that advised over others unless you truly need speed. Smart weapons from the Rimsenal Enhanced Vanilla mod actually pair very well with this armor though since they give an increased accuracy bonus that can counter the Nervesuit's accuracy debuff (I personally use this combo with the Smart Sniper Rifle, results in some very nice, speedy snipers who have yet to let me down in a fight).



Jotun
They really do pack a punch per hit but should not be given to a pawn with low shooting skill since they'll generally miss even at optimal distance unless they have a Muspell, which is basically a punchier minigun. They excell at killing mechanoids as the guide says as well as any really big animal but are not the best choice against multiple soft-body targets since you will usually want faster firing or more accuracy over the unneeded extra damage.

The Fafnir shotgun is fantastic at close range against anything however and most soft-body targets will be disabled or outright killed after one burst if it's at least an excellent Fafnir, compared to other shotguns it has a lower rof and accuracy but I think the damage makes up for it in most scenerios.

Dunder Satchel Charges can breach most walls in one or two shots and are amazing against an EMP'd mechanoid, just be sure to take out any sappers who may have this weapon as soon as possible.

The Ormbane Assault Hammer is very powerful but suffers from less swings per second, however if you have the Federation Rimsenal mod installed then no other melee weapon will shread through Feds like this one.

Jotun armors include one that speciallizes in defense, making one of your pawns kind of like a centipede, and another speciallizing in fire-support; it greatly reduces aiming time, by 100%, you can think on the implications of that yourself for a moment... and back down to earth because the armor is especially weak in melee combat so just keep that in mind.



Tisiphone
These weapons are ranged options for blunt damage, serving the sole purpose of destroying Federation pawns. In the case of Federation raids, Tisiphone weapons annihilate Fed pawns far more than any other weapon, especially the Harrower Kinetic Lance. Tisiphone's Nemesis armor also makes your pawns pretty much immune to fire or energy damage (save at the neck, which will be being changed in the future), meaning Federation pawns become the easiest thing to kill so long as you have Tisiphone arms. In fact I think asside from Jotun's Tank armor, the Nemesis Reactive Carapace has the most defense possible for power armor.
However...
Against anything aside from the Federation, Tisiphone weapons could be replaced with almost anything else, they really only excell at killing things weak to blunt and if it isn't weak to blunt then you should use a different weapon that can better take on said enemy. I'm not sure why but on paper Tisiphone seem fantastic, in actual combat however they don't really preform that much better than vanilla weapons, roughly the same in fact. They have far faster warmup times but their damage, rof and sometimes range are lacking compared to even vanilla weapons (that being said they are still capable of killing enemies when needed, they're just outshined by pretty much anything else outside of their original purpose, especially with some of the other Rimsenal mods installed).

The Oppressor Thudd Gun is unlike other shotguns: it fires a slug-like canister that explodes when it reaches its target, hitting all surrounding tiles with equal ammounts of blunt damage. It's something like a mix of a shotgun and a grenade launcher but again it's best suited for Federation pawns more than normal enemies.

If you are using the Sidearm mod with this then I suggest equipping every pawn with a Survival Knife if you can. The knife gives a bonus to global work speed and is actually a fairly effective melee weapon so there's no reason why a pawn shouldn't have this out when they are working around the colony.

Tisiphone armors excell at survival in any condition, both armors are easily capapble of keeping your pawns comfortable in either the coldest ice sheets or the hottest deserts while also possesing good defense bonuses. As stated Tisiphone's Nemesis Reactive Carapace makes heat damage almost negligable (actually a legendary RC will negate almost all heat damage). The Alecto Hazard Carapace is exceptional for environmental survival, absolutely no temperature will overcome it and it gives a 100% resistance to radiation so even a nuclear fallout is survivable.



Graydale
In comparison to all other weapons across Rimsenal mods and vanilla, Graydale is the most reliable and adaptive line of weaponry available and probably the most unique I've seen in mods. Whether a result of the coding needed to make them work or completely intentional, Graydale weapons aside from the Pistol, HSMG and Combat Blade posses no quality modifiers. This means that any of the MRS or MLS variations will always have the same stats, no possiblity of your craftsman making a poor, awful or shoddy gun but at the same time no possibility of a good, excellent or legendary one. While this may seem problematic, on a true Rimworld game run where you can't just reload a previous save to prevent your colonists from ending up with crappy equipment, this is a god-send.

Another unique traight of Graydale weapons is the MRS Carbine and the Multi-launcher can be modified with craftable modules to switch to or back from multiple types of firearms, this means that should you decide you now need a sniper rifle, an incindiery launcher, a shotgun or an LMG, you do not have to craft a new weapon but only a module which costs far less resources to make. Switching between variations is done at the Graydale crafting table and takes very little time, so you can even switch mid firefight if really needed. The weapons are also generally cheaper than even vanilla weapons to manufacture and tend to posses good accuracy at the distances they're built to operate at.

All Panther MRS variants preform close to the same but will acomplish their purpose well enough to be worth it. The Panther-S LMG is probably the most reliable LMG in the game in terms of accuracy, Panther-R and Panther-C perform about the same in terms of damage but differ in optimal distance, Panther-M is essentially a faster firing, less damaging sniper rifle.

The Jaguar Multi-launcher is more accurate than a standard grenade launcher, though it posseses less damage per shot. One Jaguar can give your colony explosive, incindiery and smokescreen options for a low resources cost.

Comparing Graydale's close-range firearms, the Jaguar Buckshot setting does more instant burst damage than the other weapons but lacks in accuracy and fire-rate, the MRS Carbine and the Caracal HV SMG are just about the same in terms of close-range effectiveness in practice but the Carbine has greater range while the Caracal HV SMG has potentially more dps. In my own testing I've found that the Caracal is better suited for close-range combat compared to the above but only if you have the resources to spare and get one of the better quality modifiers when you craft it.

Grenades aren't much to mention as far as I can tell, they're essentially the same just less damaging but throwable more often.

The Combat Blade is a decent choice for melee, almost as good as a plasteel longsword and gives an increased plant-cutting speed so if you have a farmer who doesn't fight or if you have the Sidearm mod give one to them or your lumberjack for a little boost in workspeed.

Graydale's Laconian Pioneer Armor is basically normal Power Armor with several 10% bonuses to workspeed and effectiveness related to construction as well as a 10% bonus to aiming time. The armor is built for a "combat engineer" and does just as it says, any constructer or worker would benefit from this armor outside of combat as well. Since those bonuses do not increase or decrease with the quality or integrity of the Pioneer Armor, the Panther MRS or Multi-launcher become that much more reliable in conjuction with this power armor.



As for the Excelsior Melee Armor: if you are melee and not up against Federation units then use it. It gives not only several very good bonuses to melee-related stats but also a small personal shield that's essentially a shield belt without the belt. I have not yet fully tested what happens when a shield belt runs out while you are wearing this armor but based on what happens when you take one off while wearing it, it's likely that the armor's shields go inactive while a powered up shield belt is equipped. If the shield breaks then the armor's shield may activate and start regenerating immediately or the shield belt becomes your only shield source. In any case, a standard shield belt has more shield capacity than the armor's shield, whether it regenerates faster than the armor's or slower I haven't checked yet.


That's pretty much it for what I've found here.
In review:
- Yunhwa is specialized for unarmored targets and causing pain
- Jotun is specialized for killing mechanoids
- Tisiphone is purely blunt damage and annihilates Federation pawns but aren't more useful against anything else compared to the other options
- Graydale is the most reliable and adaptive set of arms, good for true Rimworld playthroughs
- Excelsior Armor = Melee's best friend
- be VERY afraid of Satchel Charge armed sappers, one will destroy your defenses in
seconds, two will obliterate them if they are not taken out first

(I seriously cannot stress this enough, the Satchel Charge does 200 damage a pop, turrets have a base 100hp, steel walls have 350hp, sandbags have 450hp. The reload time on SCs is less than 5 seconds; if you don't take out a sapper armed with them before they get to their target, they'll do some serious damage if not just destroy your walls and defenses and good luck if you have a pawn in the blast radious. If you're facing more than three... then you are boned and the AI storytellar either hates you or will fail to realize just how bad they've screwed you over.)



{as extra if you have other Rimsenal mods}

- Federation arms are good against the majority of targets and are best used at a distance,
their main drawbacks are low rof and very pricy to buy or resource heavy to make, all of
them use heat energy as their damage type

- Rimsenal Defense
- The Graydale HMG and HGL nests are amazing manned defense systems that easily
outshine mortars.
- The Jotun manned weapon systems are a bit bugged but easily destroy armored targets.
- Yunhwa automated turrets are best for pests, animal assaults and crowd control.
- Tisiphone's sniper turret is worthless at the moment, for some reason it has the turret's
accuracy listed at 35% if I recall, making the effective accuracy 29%. It rarely hits anything
and doesn't do enough damage to justify its combat implimenation even over a vanilla turret.
(This may have been fixed in the last update, have not yet checked.)

- EMP Rifle from Enhanced Vanilla is a beautifully OP thing, which is probably why a version of Enhanced Vanilla without the EMP Rifle was released. That and raiders with it will pretty much completely disable your defenses.



If you have any questions about these armaments let me know and please leave input on this if you've found anything else out too. If you find something that contradicts what I have here post that too, I'd love to know more about this stuff. I will be regularly updating this discussion with any new information I've found or corrections to any missinformation I've typed up here.

P.S. I have never used the Rimsenal Feral mod so I have no knowledge on what's best used against them but my guess is a mix of Yunhwa and Jotun weapons. I've used this mod along with Rimsenal Enhanced Vanilla, Federation and Defense, Sidearms, More Vanilla Turrets, Megafauna, Fences, Advanced Energy and ♥♥♥♥ Friendly Fire. I have not used it with that combat rebalancing mod I've heard of.

I realized that I have also never tested these weapons against mega-insects, nor do I have much experience fighting them since I usually do all I can to prevent an infestation. Considering the fact that they on paper have more resistance to sharp than blunt my best guess is that Tisiphone weapons would work better against them. If you have the Rimsenal Federation mod though then I assume that Federation weapons would be best since the mega-insects don't have any heat resistence (at least on the wiki). Any Input on that would be much oblidged.

Last edited by TheVictoryKiwi; 28 Sep, 2017 @ 9:47pm
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Showing 1-6 of 6 comments
TheVictoryKiwi 17 Aug, 2017 @ 10:30am 
One other side note: I did some more testing comparing the weapon branches used by a fully armed 12 man colony of all the same skill levels and traits (10 across the board and only the sanguine, kind and steadfast traits) and using vanilla weapons and power armor at normal quality as a base test, here's what I've found. (also no turrets or defenses were used save sandbags)

Vanilla: fire spread as you'd expect, most animals weren't a problem, tribals, colonists and mechanoids as you'd expect, Federation pawns were particularly hard to beat when they were beaten. I used the minigun and/or rocket launcher as the vanilla special weapon and the mods stated in the main post.

Yunhwa: Your colonists engage the enemy at closer ranges than normal. Spike Rifles fire first and hit somewhat distant enemies, next come the Microwave Cannons and then finally just a tsunami of endless shards flying at the enemy. These weapons really will tear apart tribals and animals but only when they get close enough and potentially become a problem, however the Yunhwa armor can give your pawns enough speed to make distance again. Expect allot of downed enemies. I gave all of them the twin pistols at one point and anything that got close enough died almost instantly except Megafauna. Mechanoids were not easily killed and overrun my pawns several times. Snipers can be very problematic to fight with Yunhwa weapons alone. Federation annihilated my pawns repeatedly, would not recomend.
Also, make a 2-wall thick bunker with tough doors and equip only Vector Shots and pretty much any tribal or animal raid can be beaten, eventually.

Jotun: The normal amount of fire spread you'd expect but less frequent, anything that got hit usually went down. I found that supressing enemies with 4 Muspell LMG and Fire Support armor equipped pawns prevented most things from getting through. Mechanoids put up a fight but aren't much of a problem, Federation gives a challenging fight but less than normal, animals are much more of a problem. Pirate raids ended fast lol.

Tisiphone: Pawns fired their weapons more frequently and at slightly less range. Federation raids are like little to no challenge to beat, anything else was about the same as vanilla. It was essentially a tradeoff of less damage for more defense.

Graydale: The fire spread was interestingly well localized, it was less like a mass of random bullets and more like waves of bullets, increasing as the enemy got closer. Using the Multilauncher to pepper enemies or cause fires to reroute or soften enemies was very effective and every pawn was highly accurate at the optimal ranges. Every fight was slightly better than vanilla. I later compared it to all masterwork quality vanilla equipment and only at that point did vanilla equipment do better. One unique advantage here was smokescreen, which was useful in combat when the colonists' positions were about to get overrun.

Federation: Pawns started firing from a longer distance away and usually killed enemies at that distance. Anything that got closer than optimal distance occasionally became a problem. Everything except Federation was easier to kill, Federation pawns also fired optimally at that distance so getting them closer was not helpful unlike with vanilla equipment.


I graded all of this based on the ammount of time it took to end the raid successfully, the number and severity of injuries and/or casualties and how reliably similar the results were. I tested each weapon branch against Animal, Tribal, Pirate, Mechanoid and Federation raids, 10 times each and in a flat, temperate biome with all-year growing period.
Last edited by TheVictoryKiwi; 2 Sep, 2017 @ 12:46am
TheVictoryKiwi 17 Aug, 2017 @ 11:05am 
One MORE side note (I'm sorry, I'm typing so much here but the Rimsenal pack is pretty big), the Smart and Charge weapons from Enhanced Vanilla pretty much outmach the Graydale and Vanilla weapons for general use in several circumstances, however they are not nearly as effective against most animals as Yunhwa or against Mechanoids as Jotun and are allot more expensive to buy or resource heavy to produce.

- Burst Charger is an amazing assault rifle, it's pretty much just a better assault rfile.

- Smart weapons have an accuracy buff that can turn a pawn with lvl 5 shooting skill into effectively a lvl 10 (roughly speaking, not necessarily exact), they are fantastic at staying on target for the cost of damage.

- Charge Shotgun is arguably the best shotgun for general purposes, probably better than the Jotun Fafnir Shotgun, however against a mechanoid I'd say that the Fafnir will stop Scythers faster than the Charge Shotty.

- Smart SMG is almost always a better choice than any of the Graydale weapons for close range combat when you have the resources and a good craftsman, it has a higher rof and does decent enough damage but the real reliability is in the accuracy. In my test with lvl 10s the close range Caracal HVSMG was superior to all other Graydale options, but that accuracy from the lvl 10 stat was needed, should you have less accurate pawns then you can't go wrong with the Smart SMG or a Charge Shotgun for close range. That being said, both weapons are more expensive and will require more resources as well as a harder to reach tech tree. (Graydale is also Inustrial level, unlike Smart and Charge techs wich are Spacer level)
Last edited by TheVictoryKiwi; 17 Sep, 2017 @ 9:28am
TheVictoryKiwi 2 Sep, 2017 @ 12:32am 
I'll be posting the armor stats after I'm done collecting them in a new discussion post for anyone interested. However, if you are unfamiliar with how Rimworld armor stats work then I'll explain:

In Rimworld, the first 50% for a given damage resistance translates to negating 50% of the damage of that damage type when it hits your pawn in the areas that the armor covers.

The next 50% give a percent chance (1% for every 1% past 50% but before 101%) to completely ignore a hit from that damage type when, again, it hits that area of your pawn.

Every percent after 100% increases both of these two bonuses by 0.25%, and the effective maximum resistance any armor can posses is 90% damage reduction and a 90% ignore damage chance.

So in the case of a Legendary Reactive Carapace which gives up to that 90% on both bonuses for heat damage, you will only take damage from any heat-based attack 10% of the time and when finally you do, that damage will only be 10% of the normal amount. This effectively makes heat-based-damage almost negligable in combat scenerios, so any pawn wearing a quality Reactive Carapace and armed with Tisiphone weaponry can easily take on and destroy the stronger Federation enemies or an Inferno Cannon wielding centipede.

That being said don't just stand in a fire when wearing the armor since temperatures can potentially still affect you, and it's really just not a good idea anyway.
Last edited by TheVictoryKiwi; 28 Sep, 2017 @ 9:54pm
TheVictoryKiwi 17 Sep, 2017 @ 9:27am 
Just realized a possible bonus for the Graydale weapons: they have a low resource cost to produce, asuming this also means that they aren't worth more than vanilla weapons or even less then arming your colonists with Graydale weapons will lower the total wealth of your colony, which will make raids easier to handle as a result.

If this is the case then this may be useful to exploit but probably only for smaller, less wealthy colonies since a big, wealthy colony with efficeint and skilled colonists will already raise the total wealth high enough for wealth generated by equipped weapons to not make much of a difference anyway.

Edit: This is indeed the case, any of the Panther MRS or Jaguar Launcher variations are worth much less than many vanilla weapons with a higher quality modifier, so if you intend to have a small, poor colony and want to manipulate the coding to give you less dangerous raids then Graydale is for you. (Though only do this on low level AI Storytellers, above hard difficulty this really isn't going to be that beneficial.)
Last edited by TheVictoryKiwi; 28 Sep, 2017 @ 9:17pm
TheVictoryKiwi 28 Sep, 2017 @ 9:10pm 
I made a mistake with calculating armor protection for the Reflactor Crapace: the armor does not give those 90% bonuses at legendary rank (as far as I can tell).

I looked deeper into the way defense bonuses from armor is calculated in Rimworld and I mistakenly believed that the percentages of all worn equipment are added up for calculating their protection bonus, they are not. Each individual piece protects specific areas and only applies to those areas, this means that if two pieces protect the same limb then their protection percents are added but if they do not protect the same limb then they are not added together.

The actual percentages of damage reduction and damage negation chance on the Reflactor Carapace are just under 70%, same with the suit's helmet. However a legendary carbonfiber jumpsuit underneath the armor will raise the damage reduction closer to 90% but not the damage negation chance, and it won't protect the head either. This still makes the armor very very effective for preventing heat-based damage but you won't be nearly as much of a walking tank against it.

Basically, these armors will protect you from otherwise deadly hits but don't expect to walk out there rambo style and win (unless God shines upon your RNG from above), cover and good tactics take precedence over armor when trying to survive in Rimworld.

Oh, and some have said that as armor takes durability damage (which is everytime you get hit, whether the damage was negated or not) it lowers in protection percentages. Idk if this is true or not as I have not tested this nor do I have the skills to look into the coding to find out but if it is true then that's just another reason not to get hit.

P.S. Almost done calculating armor stats and coming up with a "what armor is best for which scenerio or purpose" list.
Last edited by TheVictoryKiwi; 28 Sep, 2017 @ 9:55pm
The Flesh 13 Dec, 2017 @ 7:45am 
Generally, acquiring Yunhwa weapons early makes tribal/pirate raids a cake walk. Pawns who wield Yunhwa would likely have the highest kills in a colony, but mostly as a finisher because raiders are usually a bit torn down when they get in Yunhwa's range. That being said, everyone needs a good finisher, there's no telling that brain-damaged pirate can do in his last breath.

Also if you're running Zombieland, you can just send a pawn with Nervesuit + akimbo shard pistols and pretty much run-n-gun them until your pawn starves to death. With actual run-n-gun installed, I don't think any amount of zombies can get even 3 tiles close to your pawn. Suicide zombies' explosion radius can't match the shard pistols' range, and they're like convenient walking red barrels anyway. So if you're running Rimsenal and Zombieland, I suggest making zombies as deadly as they get or try mortaring them down for extra explosive fun, otherwise it gets boring real soon.

It's like OP said about TE and Graydale. TE being used against anyone but Feds is quite close to being useless, and I doubt it's useful against Insectoids.

Graydale is the perfect conventional firearm solution if you don't have a lvl 20 crafter chunking out high quality vanilla guns or rich enough to afford higher end weapons. Jotun massacres Mechanoids and heavy targets.

Feds weapons are an odd wonder to me. They're like the highest tech weaponry you can afford and they live up to their name, but if you want your Fed combatants to be truly effective, then micro the sh*t out of them. Every Fed shot can have a lot of impact on the battlefield, but missed shots are equally costly. Additionally, they become a deadweight when someone gets in a 10 tile range of your pawns, and don't even think about tackling melee attackers because you'll wind up lighting a fire on your own ass.

The Fed sniper rifle used to be a nerf gun because it couldn't hit sh*t even with 99% accuracy (a bug from the old times), now it's a laser gun that wets the pants of any sniper pawns. If I want to take out enemy snipers or down fleeing stragglers 50 stiles away, I can either send a Nervesuit to chase them, or use the Feds sniper rifle. You don't seem to miss, what with a 3 round burst. Kill Scythers, then send a Feds sniper and a Jotun sniper to a crashed ship, and you can safely change Centipedes' middle name to "Free Plasteels", takes them several hours to get close enough to even fire their weapons.

The Plasma caster essentially lets you smell napalm in the morning, every raid, every siege. Don't let the short range and the slow projectile discourage you, most pawns can't outrun the blast anyway. My defenses feel paper-thin without a Plasma caster on duty. Place fake flammable covers in your killbox and go to town. You can roast enemies behind cover and do it better than Vector Shot, or down 10 of them at a time. Combined with Crucible Carbines and Rifles, unless enemies have Nerve suit and rush straight toward you, you can just dial their f*cking number. If the enemy has these though, don't panic and concentrate fire as soon as you see them, and run like hell if you see that green sphere flying slowly towards you.
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