As I told you in your appeal, you are not the one that enforces our rules, we do. Next time you feel something is rude or insulting, you have 3 options. Ignore it, hide it, or report it. Period.

The problem with your examples, while I will admit, you did put some good thought into them, is as follows.

Fact, when people are marked, alot ot times future people wont waste their time making new reports since nothing more can be done. Since being marked was in fact considered the kiss of death for traders, once your name was in red, a majority of people I have seen send in complaints after a person got marked just chalk it up to 'they should have looked at the guys rep first" and move on, not wanting to dwell on how and why they personally got scammed.

Also, you mention if the scammer got marked for something petty. Im sorry but I do not see the difference from the theft of a craft hat to the value of a golden pan. Theft is theft, a scammer is a scammer. While a craft hat means absolutely nothing to someone with a backpack like mine,to a new trader it might be his most prized posession. What you are speaking of definitely then brings it to the judgement on who is handling the report, and that again opens up the field for abuse by Mods to be lenient on one person but drop the hammer on someone else.

I am not saying all the rules in place everywhere are perfect, but, I can speak for Outpost and say if nothing else, we handle our matters consistantly. Once you move away from doing reports differently for different scenarios, thats when you open the door for every report being second guessed, being compared with what others may have had action taken against them for and a whole host of more general complaints that someone did not do their job correctly.

As I have said repeatedly, until someone comes up with concrete ways to change things, or until collectively we as Outpost Staff change our rules, I am of the opinion to leave them exactly how they are. Changing things just to say you changed them serves no purpose.

But again, I do give you credit for thinking of things and wanting rules to change to help the community.........contrary to popular belief, that happens to be the only reason the people we have on Staff here are here.

I wish to hear your opinion on what was literally, an appeal I just handled not 2 minutes ago. Names will not be used but, the person readily admitted both when he was banned, and in his current appeal, that he knew ahead of time that the person was a marked scammer but....he really wanted the unusual and effect that the scammer had so, we knowingly went ahead with the trade. One of the items in the trade happened to be a Golden Pan, so we are clearly over a value of $2000.

What is there to redeem? You have made no less than 4 accounts to evade your ban. Thats more than enough to show you clearly do not care about the rules on Outpost.

First off, Im not here to debate anything with you. You made a comment how you wish Outpost would change due to the change in SR policy, of which I asked you to list ways to help us make it better. So far you are making general statements about what you dislike of our past ways of conducting investigations, and from my perspective, bringing up valid reasons as to why we should look the other way in certain circumstances. Its easy to want changes made but until you, us or someone else comes up with something more concrete, I see no reason for changing anything.

Realize this, rules are made and must be interpreted so that they are clear, easy to understand, and in a black & white nature so that during a report, it is either a proven or dismissed situation. Do you really want Staff members to decide that for one person a trade is ok, but for another person it is not? Be careful there as thats now a slippery slope as then things get called in to question such as 'oh look, he has that guy in his friends list"

Also, I want this to be crystal clear here and now, we ALWAYS took the position that you traded with these scammers/scammer alts unknowingly, since its impossible to prove otherwise. The excuse is always 'I didnt know". "I didnt really look at their profile" or, I didn't know that was a rule". That last excuse is the most laughable as, practially every trade server, or community I have ever visited makes you accept their rules before joining.....yes, those same rules that no one bothers to read and simply clicks through. The same rules you had to agree to BEFORE you joined Outpost. I suppose the only way to combat that would be, to force a pop-up over and over again so people might actual pay attention to them.


On the rare occasions that it was proven that a person willingly traded with a marked scammer (I can think of 2 off the top of my head) those bans were both immediate and perm from the get go. There was no 2nd chance.

As for you mentioning someone like Frost, the meer fact that he trades so often that he should be allowed more chances is simply ludacris. Try using your analogy in a real court, to show that special dispensation should be allowed simply because of the multitude of transactions. If using the excuse that a person trades so often that 'some bad ones will slip through" is valid, then whats the point of having any rules to begin with.


As I said above, I have no reason to discuss this with you in private as these are my opinions, which Im not changing regardless of what anyone says. Should Outpost as a collective decide to change any rules, it will be my obligation to follow them to the letter, which is what I currently & always have done.


That very last comment you made "But it is also not okay to ban people for making honest mistakes." What do you propose happens to that person? Who decides if the mistake was honest or intentional? Do we look the other way, does he get no punishment at all? Do we count it against him for the nest time? Is there a dollar value attache d that makes this a different scenario? If he does it again do we then take action? What if its a good friend of his who is giving him these items, is that ok? At what point do you draw the line?

But as I said, feel free to offer up any real ways to make the site better as that is always welcome.

You make valid points but, there are many guides for people to research how to trade fairly and cleanly. By your own admission, you were banned for trading with a scammer and, while all the tools were already inplace for you to learn, you took the initive to educate yourself as to what is a legit looking account and what isnt.

The fact that profit was or was not invoved means nothing. Just because a scammer wants full price and a person wants his item depserate enough to deal with him instead of a legit trader means only in my eyes that the trader was either unwilling or uncaring to look for one from someone repuatable.

The whole idea of being given a temp ban is so that you ARE made aware that there are rules and things to look for. The smart ones and the ones that are willing to trade fairly are the ones that don't get banned again.

Now go to the other aspect, the scamming victim. Did anyone care they got scammed? Did anyone do anything to help them learn from falling prey to the scammers?

Remember what a scammer is and what he is dealing with...STOLEN ITEMS.

So, at what point should anyone be allowed or how many chances should a person be given when they are dealing with these stolen items?

If it is too hard to see someone selling 10 unusuals, with a 2 week old Steam Account, and zero hours in any game.....if you or anyone wants to somehow justify that, then by all means, I am more than willing to listen.

Am I simplifying this response, yes, as there are too many details that can be added to or subtracted from this equation, but that is the general type of reports we deal with, and thats generally the reasons behind many of the people banned on Outpost.

And believe me when I tell you, 9 out of 10 people that are banned for this reason, could care less as they simply make new alt accounts and continue to feed the scammers and help them launder their stolen items.

Outpost has LONG been dealing with scammers and scammer alts trading on our site and we do take great pride in doing what we can to slow them down whenever possible, albeit, it is a never ending job.

Mind you, while I may be an Admin here, I will state I am speaking my mind and NOT as an official response to Outpost or their rules. Just from my personal experience here. Should our rules change, then by all means we will honor and enforce them to the best of our ability. Until those rules change though, trading with scammers has never been allowed, NOR do the policy changes of SteamRep reflect anywhere that they allow or condone trading with scammers/.scammer alts either. The fact that they are no longer tagging for people that trade with them does NOT mean they said it was ok.

I am curious, what rules do you feel need changing on Outpost? We currently have always banned people who actively trade with scammers. No where does the policy change on SteamRep reflect anything stating otherwise.

Making 10+ alts will have no bearing on being permitted back on to the site, regardless of what rules may be modified based on the new SteamRep policies.

Yes, as TheAcM said is true. The item servers have been going haywire in the last few days. It is hit or miss whether trades work. Just hang in there, it will.....eventually.

I have reopened your appeal on your main acct. That does NOT mean it will be automatically accepted as there is information we will require from you.