Hello. Is this mod compatible with Key Loyalties?

plea se updat

I don't know if this is not updated to play with the current patch or if it doesn't play with my mod pack. But I just reached the information age and the whole world got -189 loyalty and on the next turn the whole world became free cities and I lost...

Could you maybe add an option to disable or reduce these effects for AIs, maybe depending on AI level?

`Yeah I can see what below comments are saying but I am willing to try it. Loyalty is a great concept that was not properly fleshed out by the devs

I like this mod, as it actually makes me consider amenity and happiness needs of my cities, which is good.

Unfortunately, the AI doesn't seem to be able to handle it at all. I've played about three games now using it, and every time the AI succumbs to its own over expansion and ineptitude, and starts losing cities. A couple loses wouldn't be an issue, but the compounding loyalty modifier of all those free cities means that, pretty quickly, the AI can't win their cities back, and eventually entire continents are sprawling with free cities and overthrown capitals. And gods help them if the AI enters a Dark Age. There's no coming back from that for them.

That said, there is the entertainment factor of watching the AI bad mouth me, only to lose their capital and the next turn and cease to exist.

Yea i felt as if Trading Posts were probably weirdly special, nothing else like them in the game. A building that isn't a building. Not able to link an amount for religious pressure from a city to amenities is odd to me, but okay fair enough. The granularity system is more of "it should be this way" in the base game, and i couldn't really think of how it would break other systems. Essencially adding new thresholds with new names, etc and how that would then effect everything using said system.

I appreciate your ideas but just in general, all of them are out of scope with this mod. I just wanted to make Happiness and Loyalty more punishing for ignoring; I'm not interested in making huge bonuses for happiness. Rather, the reward should be that your empire doesn't fall apart :)

1. Can't really do anything with Trading Posts in terms of modding, except change what the yields for passing through them are. Can't even have abilities detect if a Trading Post is present.

2. Can't link religious pressure and amenities.

3. An amenity system as granular as that would be really tedious to implement and break numerous abilities in the game (Scotland off the top of my head) and also break compatibility with mods.

For the other points: Amenities only affect yields and city growth, can't affect Diplomatic Favor or Power. Cannot use amenities or Happiness status to affect anything else at all. You can't use Happiness as a requirement for any modifiers.

Totally forgot to add, maybe the amenity system could effect power. Seem odd but hear me out, it would affect the power generated, but the distance at which power from buildings is give to other cities. Same threshold as the +/- loyalty. So normal is 6 tiles (without other GP or CS modifying it), at +3/+4= +1tile, +5/+6= +2tiles, +7 and up= +3tiles. Then -2= -1tile, -4= -2tiles, -6 or more= -3tiles, nothing at 7 because power should be a minimum of 3 tiles from the district imo.

Question though: I assume Diplo Favor, because it isn't earned by the city, is not affected by these Amenity Yield Modifiers, correct? That is just modified by normal flat numbers or earning, as well as, your habits as the player affecting the world (global warming, war, etc.) So no reason amenities should effect diplo. stuff, for game balance reasons.Would be interesting to see if Amenities would buff or debuff a percentage modifier to building districts (not their buildings just the district themselves.) Like for example: if you have a lot of amenities expansion would let you continue quickly setting up new districts with a district production modifier on top of the normal production modifier from the yield modifier; so that would mean if you dont have amenities for new cities you build district slower (which makes sense for warring) or faster if you planned ahead your midgame wide expansion strat, could be some fun lategame settling aerodrome plays or canals etc.

I also factored in the fact, if people play with mods that add more continents which increase the number of luxuries on a map size, if people wanna play at high number of amenities in their games, but in normal games, it rare to be playing very high or very low in amenities (unless you warring everyone all the time) so the increased numbers I think are fine, late game when you have a lot more amenities (if you limited your housing for growing your cities) then the increased yields are fun for building late game wonders or more GDR and the other yields for tourism will also help. (I assumed but don't know for sure, but I think tourism gets modified by the amenity threshold yield modifier yes?). Plus you could add values for religious pressure from a cities based on a defined rate like loyalty +/-, as I suggested in #2.

-1= -5%growth, -2= -15%growth/-10%yields/-3loyalty, -3= -20%growth/-15%yields, -4= -30%growth/-25%yields/-6loyalty -5= -35%growth/-30%yields/-6loyalty, -6= -55%growth/-40%yields/-9loyalty, -7= -60%growth/-45%yields/-9loyalty, -8 or more= -100%growth/-60%yields/-12loyalty.) cont...My example still has more substantial 'spikes' at the 3 and 5, and add 7, thresholds. -1 is only -5% growth, because with their loyalty changes that Firaxis did all new cities without a Palace start at -1 amenities. So I went by Firaxis' negative even number thresholds. Cont...

#3 Myself and @PotatoMcWhiskey from YT have always wanted an Amenity System to mean something more immediate; like to have in the base game, positive or negative bonuses for ever amenity you do or don't have, instead of every 2 or up to 4 between. It makes deciding on building improvements or districts/buildings with Amenities more immediate, where as right now, before your mod -1,0,+1,+2 are all the same. That 4 amenities, which if you are at -1 or 0, and you dont want to grow or cant means there is no benefit (say early mid-game) to building improvements or the Entertainment Complex and Arena to get those Amenities. We think each value should have different modifiers. (ex: 0=0, 1= 10%growth/2.5%yields, 2= 15%growth/5%yields, 3= 25%growth/10%yields/+3loyalty, 4= 30%growth/12.5%yields/+3loyalty, 5= 40%growth/17.5%yields/+6loyalty, 6= 45%growth/20%yields/+6loyalty, & 7 or more= 55%growth/25%yields/+9loyalty, and the other direction;

Okay I have some comments and questions with some ideas, would love a response: #1 What if (the 'buildings') Trading Posts, gave positive Loyalty to your city and/or negative Loyalty to your city if it does not have a Trading Post AND another player is trading with that city? (You in theory could target a border city with multiple trade routes from multiples of your cities.) #2 Could you add a change positively and reductively in religious pressure based on amenities (it always seemed too weak in Standard Speed games to ever naturally take over growing cities, which religion throughout history spreads rather quickly)? #2.5 ALSO, maybe increase the religious pressure you receive or push via active trade routes too (not based on amenities, but just overall)?

I just tried out a game with this and Darker Dark Ages and welp... I just saw a whole civ implode by having ALL IT'S CITIES REBEL! xD

Don't really know if having even the capitals rebel was intended, but it was funny to see a Civ disappear by overextending itself.

I will try a few more games with these mods and see whether this happens often.

You read my mind!

Oh no, my poor cities D:

Speaking of which, having the number of cities lost scale with your difficulty sounds kinda cheesy for the AI, and might kinda ruin the point of the mode on higher difficulties...if you end up making some changes for DA like you did for apocalypse, I'd probably start there to level the playing field and then do some even grosser things .

Hmmm, my gut says that it's going to work well together.

I plan to use both!

I'm even working on a separate mod for more severe Dark Age penalties...maybe that'll be too much though :)

Heya p0kiehl! I know you're busy fixing C.E. heh, but I have a question; how do you think this will interact with Dramatic Ages?

Of course, it'll work fine, but I mean from a balance standpoint. Dramatic Ages seems to do sorta what this mod is aiming to do, with excess era score becoming greater loyalty pressure, and dark ages being *awful*, and I'm wondering if combining the two would be excessive or still appropriate (since I prefer this mod's loyalty/amenity mechanics over vanilla).

Comrade Duch approves of this mod.

t''would be interesting if the city dropped a population when rebel units appear. because those are the most unhappy people.

AI is fine with the mod.

I am very interested in testing this mod.
Will it improve the ai or will ai be less competitive for human players?

The game already tried it with smaller numbers: +3/-3, and it's utterly meaningless.

Out of all the changes in this mod, the one you're pointing out is honestly the least consequential.

This is an interesting change, but +6/-6 sounds like it could be very impactful and is a big leap from vanilla values. I'm worried that it would be too easy to take a city by converting it and too hard to keep a city with a different religion than your own (maybe that's the point with the mod though and not just a balance change. Have you tried it with smaller numbers?

Hi everyone, thanks for all the comments! To make digesting the information easier, I've made a table for the Happiness levels above in the Images.

@ChrisMartin - I've been playing myself with a modified version of this for a while, but Firaxis's Amenities changes spurred me to release this :) You have interesting ideas that I'll keep an eye on, but at the moment I want to be sure I don't make everything too punishing.

@N7Zebracakes - Neat idea but unfortunately not the simplest thing to implement. I'm not sure how impactful it'd be, but I'll mull it over.

@Taco Shack - Ecstatic Cities are already rewarded with bonus yields and Loyalty. The point of this mod is to make things more challenging, not easier :P

Could you add a bonus to Ecstatic so there's a reward for it? Like maybe it just adds 1 amenity per 5 population so big cities that get to that point don't ever worry about dropping to low happiness.

This mod makes me ironically happy

Spot on!

Is it possible to scale the religion impact? Maybe tied to Enlightenment or one of the pre-reqs for modern governments? +/- 6 before, +/-3 after, to reflect the diminished role it has today? It could be unnecessarily complicated, of course, but it would add a nice touch of realism

o nice u finally released it at the perfect time aswel

Was this mod long coming, or was it a response to Firaxis weak attempt to adjust this in August patch? :)
As we see today IRL, this causes increased government spending, reduced local business revenue, and also (sadly) loss of life.
Can buildings maintenance cost increase and reduced income in cities with reduced Amenity? Should cities loose citizens?
Maybe have some Policy Cards that can be used to "enforce and/or introduce" stability until Amenity are again provided?

I very much agree that there is no challenge with Amenity in Civ6, and would love to have some adjustments to "tame" my first wide play, then late-game tall game.