Could be it depending on how they're added.
If you can suss out the conflict and it's easy to patch, I'll consider an update.

I have mods that add in new items installed too.

Chivalrous Intentions should be 100% compatible, I don't believe it touches adventure sites and reward sets at all, same with Empire Building.

WOR touches a lot, but didn't see anything in the description that specifically talks about reward sets. It's only weird cos ur getting the updated spawn sites but just not the updated rewards, and the updated reward profiles are added by the mod. Shouldn't be able to have one without the other... Would only mess things up if the actual items lists have been modified out from vanilla.

If you have time to test with some mods dropped off and can look at an update, but haven't been playing AOW3 for a while now TBH. Unless it's broke I'm not planning on updates.

Tried clearing a Seeker site that says it's a treasure site and only got 76 gold. I guess mod conflict as I've a lot of other mods installed including Chivalrous Intentions, WOR and Empire Building

I checked the mod files and all the links look good for all the mobs that use the necromantic circle spawn point.
The reward for annoyance is up to 1 random item worth up to 0.5x the unit strength of the guards (Tier 2 and up item categories), 0.1x knowledge, 0.1x mana, and any excess should be gold at 0.15x the excess left.

I doubt it's a mod conflict cos the defenders and combat enchantments seem the same and the items should draw from the base game lists (unless you have a mod touching those).
Just seems like you didn't get the item which is most of the reward... dunno if its RNG or some other conflict.

Have you received items from clearing any of the other sites?
Every reward set contains at least 1 item. If you're not getting them every time you clear a site it's most likely a mod conflict.

Yep that's it. In the game files it's summoners circle.

I think it was necromantic circle or something similar it was called

Would've been Summoners Circle which is categorized as annoyance. Should still have got an item though.
Maybe missed it in the last pass. Been a long time since I've touched this mod.

I did get unit rewards and 225 gold for one I cleared, so maybe it was just the first one was only classed as "annoyance" (though first one had wraith lkings and various other tier III undead plus choking fumes)

Thanks for the reply. Likely is another mod messing that up then. I do have lots of others installed, though i'm not sure which one it'll be.

Territorial:
Great Knowledge
Up to 2 items up to Legendary strength but selection is random
Potential bonus Mana or Gold

Raiders:
Above Avg Gold
Up to 2 items up to Epic strength but selection is random
Up to 2 units from new ‘Specialist Group Cat’ (Class themed troops, class is random)
Potential bonus Gold

Annoyance:
Avg Knowledge, Avg Mana gained
Up to 1 item up to Epic strength but selection is random
Potential bonus Gold

Wanderer (Item Racks):
Up to 3 items up to Epic strength but selection is random
Potential bonus Gold

@Dunadd

Might have another mod interfering with the rewards.
Better rewards were added in a long time ago.


Changelog:
01/09/22 V5.0

Rewards have been overhauled for all spawn sites dependent on spawn type:
A number of entries were found that had no reward links at all – thanks for raising this @dmcf

World Enders:
Avg Gold, Avg Knowledge, Avg Mana gained
Up to 2 items up to Legendary strength but selection is random
Up to 2 units from new ‘Specialist Group Cat’ (Class themed troops, class is random)
Potential bonus Mana or Gold

Destroyer:
Above Avg Gold, Avg Knowledge
Up to 2 items up to Legendary strength but selection is random
Potential bonus Gold

Since spawn sites are tougher to clear with this mod, it'd be nice to get better rewards than 50 odd gold and mana from clearing them. Maybe a bit more and some items?

No problem at all, let me know how it goes. I don't personally play with the second mod so may still need some fine tuning.

Also, if you're not already using Chivalrous intentions it's basically a must have to get the best experience from the mod.

@FuniTime

I will

Thank you for the answers and the adjustments, loving your mods, they bring a much needed spice to the game

I've also just updated the other version of the mod to scale back spawn defender and roaming strength more in line with vanilla.

Give it a try on your next game. It will be significantly easier to handle than this version though.

@Multifaced There's a roaming army setting in the game at new game setup. Should have options something like none, few, average, and many. Average is recommended for this mod, but Many is a bit of fun if you like more of a challenge.

@funitime I think the crash may have been related to alt tabbing in and out of the game, but I cannot be certain because I did not want to click on the spell again as I just wanted to play. So i just hover over them now, just in case. If it's not happening to anyone else, it must just be me alt tabbing too much.

About the defender strength, that's too bad. Might have to check out your other mod. Would have been amazing to find a better middle ground between the two.

This may have already been answered somewhere, but which setting determines how many spawn bases show up in the game? I must have maxed it out, because I have so many around my cities and it's been a relentless scramble to defend them all, they just keep coming lol

@ Multifaced @BladeofSharpness

Unfortunately the defender settings control both the structure defenders and spawn strengths, no way to separate them.

I tried to mitigate the scaling issue by boosting the strength multiplier of all base game structure defenders, but it's very hard to strike a balance that accounts for all play styles.
The mod was initially made to be challenging and essentially make spawn points behave like another AI player to fill in the early to mid game. The spawn points are meant to very difficult to take out so they're not steamrolled by the player, and keep the roaming armies active longer into the game.

I have a separate steam of the mod: Attack Protocol: Long Game
https://steamhost.cn/steamcommunity_com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2863594831

I can tweak the strength values in this, as it's more appropriate to reduce the spawn strength with long game settings as opposed to normal or faster.

@ Multifaced not sure about the crash, all of combat enchantments are from the base game and are assigned as a link i.e. not modified. Even if another mod altered the enchants they should still work, but just with the other mods changes.
Do you know what the specific enchant was, and if it happened again on reload?

I can try and replicate on my end.

Just after I posted that, the game crashed at the beginning of a fight against one of the spawn bases :(

not sure if it's just coincidence, had already cleared a few without issue, but this one had some different things like dragons and It happened when I clicked on one of the active spells for the battlefield. Is that a known problem? Might have to avoid doing that, as it felt like that was the cause of the crash it happened as soon as I pressed that button. Coincidence?

@Funi Time, Been messing around playing a game with your mod, and been loving the extra action with your spawners and having to deal with those tough spawn bases

The only thing that bothers me is that setting defender strength has such disparity from your mod to the base game and finding a happy middle ground is still challenging to do. I normally like to give the regular defenders more strength, but if I do it with your mod on, it gets tuned too hard.

Would you be able to separate the two settings? So I could still have the regular defenders at the strength I want, and then set yours up at a different strength suitable for your mod?

Thanks for your mod, it's become a staple in my AOW3 gameplay, appreciate what you have done here

Hi there
I find the special sites appropriately defended at Challenge level, but the spawners are just insane and are probably equal in strength to Mythical sites. Is it balanced as you wish here?

Is it possible to influence independently number and strength of roamers on one hand, an overall special sites defense? It seems not.

That said, I appreciate a lot your mod, thanks.

Try this out if you play a slower game

Attack Protocol: Long Game
https://steamhost.cn/steamcommunity_com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2863594831

Also I have a few ways I can do this.

I can lower the rate of spawn growth rate which will keep the same amount of combat events but roamers will stay weaker for longer.

I can increase the spawn times which will reduce the amount of combat and keep roamers weaker for longer.

Or I can drop the starting or ending spawn strength which will make all spawns weaker across the board.

Thoughts?

Thanks, also what's the defender strength setting?

I've been playing at Lord difficulty, and the AI seems to start dropping around turn 40. This game, two have died so far, one around 40, and the other around turn 50.

Hi Verdacy,

Unfortunately not, all I can do is change the defender strength multiplier but that applies to all structures as well. I tried to mitigate this by boosting the strength of all structure defenders so you can lower the settings a bit without making everything too weak.

I might just have to make a separate version of the mod at some point with lower spawn growth values. At what point to AI tend to get wiped out, and what AI difficulty are you playing with?

I love the idea behind this mod, and I've been using it for a week or so now. Unfortunately, I play on Super Slow, and the wandering spawns keep on obliterating the AI. Is there a way for you to add options (possibly under defender strength) to tweak spawn frequency/ramp-up speed?

Latest update released for trial.

New unit sets, should be more thematic and greater inclusion from chivalrous intentions if running both mods.

Rebalanced battle enchantments for spawn sites based on spawn type, scaling down to the weakest (annoyance)

Rebalanced (or maybe not balanced, we'll see) rewards from spawn sites, scaling down to the weakest (annoyance). Merging of some reward lists with PBEM reward lists so if you're running both mods should see the benefits.

Slight reduction in strength of the strongest defenders to try and reduce 3 T4 spawns to 2 on 1.5x defender strength.

Please let me know if there's any issues, balance changes required. All the hard work's done, the rest is just tweaking numbers / entries.

All good, smokescreen is back on the menu

Turns out I was mistaken there. Rise of the Allfather was up which gives all dedicated to good units +3 Resistance and I'd cast some Keeper of the Peace spells that made unit and heroes dedicated to good. Plus I have a mod installed that gives units +1 Defence for each Champion rank. So Smoke Screen was working fine. Sorry for the mistake.

Damn, that sucks - was pretty thematic I thought, but they rely heavily on ranged as well.

In the process of updating the mod now, but going to take a little longer than I'd planned.

Working on standardising rewards per difficulty (spawn points only), can guarantee they'll need some balancing though

Updated a bunch of unit sets for the spawns and defenders (hopefully it'll add some extra thematic units from Chivalrous intentions as well)

Have a list of battle enchantments for the spawn points - decreasing in strength with the spawn type (smokescreen was in a number of them, but maybe not as appropriate as I thought)

The Smoke Screen spell on the Brigand Fort is appropriate, but it seems to buff the player's units defence and resistance as well as the defending brigands.

Hmm I'll still take a look because that was on normal difficulty. I need to make sure it's still viable on x1.5 and x2 difficulty settings.

Appreciate the feedback

Tbh it was hard, but not impossible, and I didn't lose anyone. I think it's because I have chivalrous intentions installed and it made one of the tier II units a human mage type with call lightning, so I was getting hir by two Call Lightnings a turn. So probably just random chance that that unit came up randomly.

Sorcerers enclave spawns using the necromantic circle spawn point. Perhaps that doesn't give a reward in the base game. Seems strange that it wouldn't though.

I'll take a peek.
This mod doesn't touch any of the base game rewards, though it's sounding like maybe it should.
In saying that, the main benefit to clearing sites is to protect your territory as opposed to scoring loot. I'll have a think about it.

Yeah I still need to balance the spawn defenders a bit and most definitely the combat enchantments.

Won't be able to do it for a couple of days though so you'll have to bear with me.

Ah right sorry that explains the disappearing stack. I wrongly assumed it disappeared when it was outmatched

Sorcerer's Enclave seems to give no reward at all for clearing it, and it's been by far the hardest to do so far. And that was with a level 13 dwarf warrior on a giant dire bear with 18 resistance,and a level 13 elf theocrat (mounted on a young fire dragon), plus 2 elite storm sisters, an elite mage blades, an elite crusaders, and a feathered serpent. If i hadn't had the druid spell revitalise i wouldn't have managed it.

I know it's a lot to read, but have a look through the mod description. It explains how the mod works and covers many of the questions you've asked.

If you go into the mod folder you'll also find full changelog, list of all spawns, table of spawn strengths etc.

Disappearing stacks is because most stacks are set on a spawn turn timer. When the turn timer is up the current stack is de-spawned and a new (stronger) stack spawns at the spawn site. I had to make this change because if there were too many spawns they would literally stand idle and not do anything. It also has the benefit of limiting the spawns travel radius.

Spawn site descriptions are purely there to give you an idea of the type of spawn site behaviour and strength.

@dmcf

I'll try and clear things up a bit.
I've marked the behaviour settings in ()

Green units use non-hostile behaviour (wander). They won't attack you, but you can pick them off for evil player roleplaying kicks. I guess the game can't recognise them as friendly because they've spawned using a feature thay was designed to make enemies.

Red units are always hostile but some will run if outmatched (brigand). Others will always directly attack your cities (raid). The last type will just defend their territory (patrol).

Or at any rate some that show up green say "cause enemy in domain" morale penalty when you click on them

Also some roaming stacks seem to just disappear the moment a new turn begins if they're in the domain of one of my settlements and I move in heroes armies stronger than them. I saved the game to scout in every direction using heroes plus summoned cherubs to look for them and they just weren't there anywhere. No way they could have moved that far away in one turn, and as the turn begins they just seem to disappear rather than move.

A bit confusing at times that roaming armies with red flags with a skulland crossbones on and how show up red on the strategic map, but I'm not sure if they're hostile or just treasure hunters. And then some roamers show up green but when you click on them it says they're hostile.

Meant to say, when it says on dens/lairs that they "may come out to attack travellers entering their territory" or "will frequently raid nearby towns and attack travellers" that doesn't mean the defenders will do that? It mans roamers they spawn (usually much weaker than the defenders) will do that?

@ dmcf

Thanks for the feedback. Sounds like I need to tone it down a fair bit. It definitely shouldn't be that intense on normal difficulty. I'll rework the assigned combat spells.

Open for suggestions as well.
I want to add a little bit of extra challenge while keeping things thematic.

For the world ender spawns, i wanted them to be a bit of a nightmare to deal with. The rest should scale down in difficulty from there.

I took them with 3 full armies plus a couple of summoned eagles. Each army led by a hero about lvl 8 or 9, one of them my leader. But with it being a fort and my attempts at disjunctions of bloodbath failing two out of three times, and naga asuri phasing in, things went a bit pear shaped and I came close to losing heroes and units.Likely because I'm elves and I don't try and melee anything tough much, except with warlord heroes.

It was possible to do, but tricky and had to reload a couple of times.

I take your point with the combat spells at the spawn points. They might be a bit overtuned, I'll take another look at it. I want it to be hard but not tedious. You should be high level to take them out successfully, or utilise multiple stacks.

As far as I can tell concealment works against roamers