Mega Dope

Actually the fuel consumption is the same with, and without the mod. Unless some other mod is messing with the fuel consumption values, the engines are now taking about 25 times the amount of fuel the wiki states is normal

For some reason after adding this mod, a single large ship hydrogen engine now consumes 6 thousand liters of fuel per second while only at 22% loading

You have a drawing of the ship from the screenshot. Or the link will do.

Nice

form what i can tell losing about 4% a sec

is anyone having problems with the mod as i am going through a lot it more then normal an not sure why

i woudl like bot hhydgen and oxegen t obe a bit more Realistic cuse unles truninghydgen ingen or truster both are to ezy this make the hydgen much more usful im hoping the more realistic O2 mod wil make ox more inporten i think the two may not get along tho guna hav et oraly test them

Does this also change the jetpack? You use fuel way too fast (and move a tad too fast as well), but the more realistic O2 mod nerfs it so much it's basically got infinite fuel.

For anyone curious you can get the hydrogen engines to work with any mod that changes their efficiency or how they work.

@Agressor actually i'm using petrol for engines, ratio is very balanced

This mod change and overwrite settings for jetpack. Im using another mod for jetpack making impossible to use it on planets. Its any way to keep hydro rebalance only for engines and thrusters ?

I got this mod to make small grid hydrogen ships a possibility. Seems like the only downside to this mod is that hydrogen becomes overpowered in large ships. I took a large ship up into space and back and didn't even use 1% of the fuel in my large hydrogen tank. It said 17% full when I left and when I got back. I can also fly around in my jetpack for literally an hour with only one hydrogen tank in my inventory.

If you made this mod to address the issue with small grid hydrogen ships, perhaps a better fix overall would be to reduce the amount of hydrogen that the small grid hydrogen thrusters use. But maybe I'm misunderstanding what the purpose of the mod is. Let me know. :)

If someone ends up continuing the work on this mod, please post a link to your work in the comments. The mod creator [Axtel Sturnclaw] abandoned the mod on Feb 8; refer to the very last sentence in his comment on that date.

Thanks for the info. I will gladly take a look at the files. I was just interested and thanks for responding so quickly

As you can tell by the Last Updated date in the top of this page, I haven't changed anything in this mod since well before the Hydrogen Engine was added to the game. It's a known issue that the H2 engine is not compatible with these changes, however I have mostly lost interest in Space Engineers due to the inherent limitations of, and fundamental issues with, the survival gameplay.

You're more than welcome to copy the mod files and update it to be compatible with the Hydrogen Engine; I am likely not going to be coming back to SE modding short of a miracle so I disclaim any control over this mod's files! :D

Whenever I use this mod, the Hydrogen Engine does not seem to work. Have you changed anything with the hydrogen engine?

did you rebalance the h2/o2 generator to be thermodynamically possible? (IE- hydrogen you make from o2/h2 generator isn't enough to self-sufficiently power the o2/h2 generator)

Why not you adjust density to 0.07 it's fair since it's the real hydrogen density as liquid?
It solve 50% of problems!

Hi,
i have uploaded a mod using yours as example,
https://steamhost.cn/steamcommunity_com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1819326888

So, FYI )

@Axtel Surnclaw Thank you so much. It worked out after a bit of finding the file. You really helped us out!

@BouncySlime: I believe the relevant file is named Gases.xml, though it's been about two years since I played Space Engineers. It's a fairly simple matter to create your own mod, simply follow the tutorial to setup the mod folder structure, and copy Gases.xml in from the base game and strip out all the child XML nodes not relating to hydrogen gas. You can then change the value of the EnergyDensity tag, and you'll have a mod that you can publish to the steam workshop for your friends to use.

Please note that it's been a very long time since I made a mod, so you're going to have to refer to the tutorials and the KeenSWH forums for the specifics of the procedure.

@Axtel Sturnclaw Hey. First of all this is an amazing mod! But is it somehow possible to change the value of the Hydrogen not to 0.0184 but instead to something like 0.005? Me and a few friends would need a value a bit lower than you made it in your mod but can't find any config file or something, like that. Is it possible to somewhere just change the value? It would be really appreciated if you would help me out. Have a great day!

@BroedipusRex At the moment, I do not. The link in the comments is for an earlier picture, before I built the Buccaneer you see now. I'm not sure if the build even exists anymore, as I've had to reinstall Windows several times since I've last played Space Engineers, and I never published it to the workshop.

Do you have a link for the ship in the picture. I saw one of the earlier comments asking for it, but the link you provided seemed to be a different ship.

@Hoshidan Indeed I am! It's a bit of a shame more people haven't read those books, but it's served me well as a unique username.

@Axtel Sturnclaw i see you must be a big Redwall fan based on your username

Confirmed. Both types of mod work together.

ok thats kinda what i was thinking. that they edit the amount of energy used and yours edits h2 directly

@dedpull420: good question. The answer is *probably* yes, as those mods are (likely) affecting the power values on the thruster directly. Because this mod also adjusts those values (as a minor balance tweak), you'll have to load this mod first in the load order if you want the two to cooperate.

Does this couple with hydrogen thruster efficiency mods?

That's so bizarre.But yes, the new(ish) H2 Engine in the game is just an electricity generator that runs on hydrogen. Producing watts for the grid like a battery.

So i guess in terms of coding, it's hardly different than the H2 thruster itself. xD

Thanks again, for the help, information and the mod. c:

@Amorak: no problem! Glad I can help you understand how things work a little better. Sorry about confusing engines/thrusters - aerospace parlance tends to use "engines" when they're talking about main propulsion and "thrusters" when they're talking about secondary propulsion; that's why you hear "the Saturn V's engines" and "the LEM's maneuvering thrusters".

Funnily, it's the game's *conceptual definition* of a "thruster" that mandates it runs on electricity - there's a special little module attached to the hydrogen thrusters in the data files that specifically says they need "electricity" from hydrogen fuel instead of from the ship's power grid.

I also didn't know that H2 Thrusters technically ran on electricity in the game's coding.

Eitherway, thanks! I'm sure my friends an i will greatly enjoy using hydrogen now without it being too broken.

... okay, yeah. I finally found a different comment on a difference hydrogen balance mod like 12+ pages deep.

" Explanation of how it works:
- Keen's hydrogen engines actually use power (watts) to produce thrust, just like atmo/ion thrusters
- The power comes from hydrogen, which has a multiplier called EnergyDensity (which defaults to 0.001556 at this time)
- I'm changing that multplier to 0.03112, so hydrogen makes 20x as much energy, and is thus consumed 20x slower "

I didn't realize hydrogen 'engines' were thrusters. Because H2 engines are something else.
So talking about about power draw and creation in terms of a thruster made no sense to me.

Got it. c:
Denser gas = Higher efficiency = Requirements met with fewer liters = Less fuel consumption.

Sorry, that took far too long to understand. xD
But thank you. (Man i could be an asshole and just not download the mod after all that work.)

Things may have changed since I last booted SE, but at the time this mod was written, all engines internally used a value measured in watts (power, volts*amps) instead of a flow rate of hydrogen. The flow rate was a derived property of the thruster's power consumption and the energy density of H2 gas, and changing the energy density affects the flow rate for all things that consume H2 gas for power.

I believe what you are seeing is a derived UI calculation of L/s instead of the actual internal power consumption - if H2 thrusters were internally using L/s instead of Watts, this mod would cease to function entirely.

In essence, you have the correct idea.

In short, i get the concept, but i don't understand how it translates to tangible differences in the game.

So 1kg of Ice is 10L of H2 in game, right? So this mod makes it so there's more potential energy in that same volume of gas.

But how does that translate to the thruster's consumption of Liters per Second while in use?
10L of gas is now worth more, i understand, but the thruster itself just says it consumes in L/s. It doesn't show the background process of energy density.

So with greater density, the thruster requires fewer liters of H2 to burn to create the same amount of thrust? Indirectly lowering its fuel consumption?


(O2/H2 generators produce same amount in Liters. Anything consuming H2 requires fewer liters to meet the requirement in energy to function? Be it thruster or engine, thus having the side effect of lower H2 consumption all-round?)

@Amorak: the mod alters the 'energy density' of hydrogen gas, not the volume. Every thruster in SE defines their resource consumption in units of power - Watts, kiloWatts, etc. For ion and atmo thrusters, this is directly taken from the power grid, but hydrogen engines consume hydrogen gas for power, at a flow rate such that 'flow * energy density = power draw'. Increasing that energy density value lowers the flow rate of H2 engines (as it needs less gas to fulfill the same power needs), but doesn't affect the capacity of tanks or flow rate of generators. The only physical attribute we're violating here is specific energy, and even then it's questionable whether the original value is correct.

Hopefully this is a simple enough explanation while still remaining comprehensive.

I'm still kind of unclear at what this mod does.
Does it just change the efficiency of 'refining' ice to gas? i.e. instead of 1kg of ice to 10L of H2 it's 1kg to .. well more than 10L?
And because the ice itself outputs more gas, it makes setups using H2 and gas generators more viable as they have a higher flow-rate to keep up with the thrusters.

But that doesn't impact setups that run off of H2 tanks, without generators, at the thrusters themselves are unchanged an still consume H2 at the same rate.

Would you mind clarifying what it does in.. well. Simple terms?

This mod doesn't alter the hydrogen engine (or any of the thrusters) directly, but instead it changes the energy density value of the hydrogen gas resource. I'm long gone from the SE scene, but unless the hydrogen engine specifically defines its own value for H2 energy density, this mod should affect it just the same.

Does this affect the hydrogen engine at all? The one used for generating power, I mean. That thing still seems to piss through hydrogen at an unsustainable rate.

I have since created my own mood that adjusts hydrogen energy value. Same principal. Thanks. Though now I feel player jetpack is far too effective in 1g atmosphere. So I'll look at adjusting player jetpack energy consumption.

It's been a very long time since I've tested this mod, but going by the numbers above, a given volume of H2 gas (e.g. that produced per-second by an Oxygen Generator or stored by a Hydrogen Tank) will last for 12x as long as vanilla. This allows a small-block Oxygen Generator to run approximately 4-6 hydrogen thrusters at a time without needing a large, clunky Hydrogen Tank.

I read the description, but what does that all mean? How much more burn time can you get from hydrogen thrusters?

It's been quite a while since I've played Space Engineers, but I'll look into it the next time I do.

Could we get an update for this mod to also effect the hydrogen engine now that it is out? I've used this mod forever and now that we have the hydrogen engine I want to use it to make ground vehicles but its so stupidly heavy and eats fuel like crazy.

i subscribed thank u!

The Dragonfly has hatched! Here now at a workshop near you!

cant wait for it as i might modify it to make it like the star wars land jet things or like the banshee from halo

A reproduction of the Drake Dragonfly, coming soon to a workshop near you.

Being able to fly it in survival is the main reason I made this mod.