Ive made my own changes to weapons and ive decreased the AP of 5.56x45 AR to 0.55-0.6, and 7.62x51 to 0.7-0.75. I think its better that way.

I think the armor pen should be lower on most weapons. When using this mod the weapons are far better than any other vanilla weapon and most modded weapons just due to the armor pen. I like using this mod because of all the variance but it makes it hard to use other weapons when these weapons are far superior than others.

Just tried out this mod, both the damage values and armor penetrations seem way out of whack.

Just take a look at a couple of vanilla weapons and you can see how far out some of these AP values are. Vanilla assault rifle is 11 damage with 16% AP. Charge rifle is 15 damage and 35% AP.

Also compare to the targets you are engaging. Marine armor, the best vanilla armor you can get, gives 100% Sharp protection.

Stolen straight from the wiki:

Originally posted by From The Wiki:

-The armor rating is reduced by the armor penetration value, dependent on the weapon.
-The remaining armor rating is then compared against a random number from 0 to 100:
-If the random number is under half the armor rating, the damage deflects harmlessly.
-If the random number is over half the armor rating, but not higher than the armor rating, the damage is mitigated.
-If the random number is greater than the armor rating, the armor has no effect.

This means that for the majority of the weapons in this mod when shooting at the best armor possible, marine armor, they will just flat out ignore the armor about 90% of the time.


Ex: Kvkk 62 VS Marine Armor.

100 armor - 75 AP = 25 effective armor. Then roll the random number, 12% chance to deflect the round, 13% chance to mitigate and 75% chance to just ignore the marine armor and hit the pawn underneath.


But at the same time, they are doing such small amounts of damage that the pawn can probably tank it with his flesh alone. In the above example, the Kvkk 62 does 7 damage. Lets say that you hit a pawn right in the hand. A hand has 20 hp. Your Kvkk 62 round that sliced through marine armor like butter only does 1/3 the health of a hand on a direct hit. Pawns can't use their armor to block shots, but they could be protecting themselves from this rifle Vader style and just block bullets with their hands and not lose either hand.

Given that it appears most weapons in this mod have greater than 100% AP, armor might as well not exist as far as most of these guns are concerned, but at the same time their damage values drop down to 4. That's like shooting foam nerf sticks.


This is what I mean when I say something is out of whack. The damage and the AP don't make sense compared to the health and armor of pawns or in comparison to the weapons already in the game.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/149351194781941760/528764698116620298/4795272-vaderabilitytutaminis1.gif



Also, another semi-related point, ranges. Why do the machine guns that are supposed to be firing larger, heavier bullets, have shorter ranges than the assault rifles that fire intermediate cartridges? Machine guns fire full power rifle cartridges, the same as most sniper rifles so while their accuracy is grossly worse, their base range should be about the same.

+Cerevox

Ranges are based on vanilla values. vanilla LMG has shorter range than vanilla Assault rifle.

Based on the info I collected, Rifle caliber rounds are not effectively stopped by any form of armour except for a few shots in the case of ceramic fiber composites. Intermediate caliber rounds are stopped semi-reliably and pistol cartridges are stopped across the whole range period.

That was the goal. I used inverse logarithmic function(with surface pressure and kinetic energy as a variable) to approximate penetration depth for each round based on it's mass and cross-sectional area, and based my pen values off of that.

From my personal experience play-testing, the AP values seem accurate enough, since even after penetrating the damage is still subtracted. Pistol rounds get mostly stopped by armor, while rifles remain deadly even when you are wearing Power Armour, and assault rifles still pose a threat.

Damage is based on vanilla values.

Range is based on vanilla values.

Accuracy is based on vanilla values.

AP is not, and it is deliberate.

Also point on damage.

It is taken from real world, put into perspective with rimworld analogues, and converted using interpolation from physical quantities such as energy, mass and momentum into rimworld. Therefore, in comparison some guns are a lot weaker than others, hence why some guns MAY have damage as low as say 4.

Same principle applies to all quantities, such as accuracy, mass(obviously), ranged cooldown and warmup, etc.

The LMG in vanilla being shorter range also really bugs me, it is pretty much the opposite of any MG role in real life.

On the AP thing...

Given that marine armor is the best possible, most of your rifles don't even allow the possibility of a glancing blow to a pawn in marine armor, they just straight up ignore it. Most of your assault rifles will ignore it about 80% of the time with a 11% chance of mitigation and 11% of deflection.

For the strongest space age armor the rimworld has, this plasteel armor seems pretty flimsy.

Also, the game hard caps armor values at 200%. Your anti-materials rifles have APs over 200%. That seems somewhat pointless, since at 200% AP you ignore all armor under all situations and conditions. 200% AP is the effective equivalent of infinity% AP.

The issue here really isn't that the weapons are deadly, it is that even peak armor is basically nothing to these guns.


On the flip side for damage, it is actually pretty interesting that you did all those calculations for real world effects, but you don't seem to have considered the actual pawn HP when doing it. An eyeball has 10hp. A pawn can take 2x 4 damage bullets to the eye, and not lose the eye. That doesn't seem right.

I can't comment on the math you may have done, but just a common sense ballpark feel for the damage amounts vs how much hp pawn body parts have reveals that pawns can soak a ludicrous number of bullets before going down from most of these guns. The same bullets that treated the marine armor like tofu.

That is why I see a problem. It is the strange dichotomy where your guns are breaching all armor but failing to do any damage to the pawn underneath without a silly number of hits.

+Cerevox
I will possibly re-visit AP values at a later date. I am fairly busy right now.