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Total War: WARHAMMER II >  Workshop > Wolfy's Workshop > [DEPRECATED, USE VCO2 INSTEAD] Victory Conditions Overhaul > Discussions
[DEPRECATED, USE VCO2 INSTEAD] Victory Conditions Overhaul
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cybvep 8 Jun, 2020 @ 1:05pm
Vampire Coast Victory Conditions
Here are some thoughts about the Vampire Coast victory conditions.

1. This is just my opinion, but excluding some special cases, I think that the Vampire Coast factions in general shouldn't be required to hold non-coastal provinces. It's not their modus operandi. "Hold X provinces" condition in general doesn't fit Vampire Coast very well, because their are raidery pirates, not classical empire-builders. Infamy, destroy faction X, build special landmarks etc. are better.
2. Considering the above, Cylostra shouldn't be required to hold all of Ulthuan outside of the coasts to gain short victory. She should be required to destroy all High Elven factions starting on Ulthuan. Harkon shouldn't be required to hold Lustria outside of the coast. He should be happy if the Lizardmen are destroyed. Noctilus could be required to hold traditional provinces of Vampire Coast factions (so his own Galleon's Graveyard, but also Vampire Coast and Sartosa for short victory) besides destroying them. Aranessa shouldn't be required to hold any specific territory outside Sartosa at all, but she should keep her build X tier 5 ports condition and her sack/loot condition could be boosted from 15 to 25 for short victory.
3. Infamy requirements for victory conditions of Vampire Coast factions could be boosted, because you gain infamy by doing piraty things. Both 6000 and 12000 are very low values IMO. Even the first shanty pirate has 8000 at the start of the game and the top one has 24000. For short victory, 15000 seems appropriate. For long victory, 25000 or sth.
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Showing 1-15 of 18 comments
Wolfy  [developer] 8 Jun, 2020 @ 2:23pm 
Thank you for your thoughts! I have in mind a general update for a v1.1.0 of this mod. However, v1.2.0 will be focused on Vampirates!
#1
Wolfy  [developer] 9 Jun, 2020 @ 2:48am 
@cybvep

Can you check this?

CHANGELOG v.1.2.0 - The Vampire Coast Update

- All "Hold X provinces" objectives have been deleted from the Vampire Coast factions
- The infamy required for all the Vampire Coast Short Victories has been updated from 12000 to 15000.
- The infamy required for all the Vampire Coast Long Victories has been updated from to 25000.
- Now The Drowned do not have to conquer all Ulthuan but just the external coast.
- Now The Drowned have to destroy all the Ulthuan starting factions.
- Now The Awakened do not have to conquer all Lustria but just the external coast.
- Now The Awakened have to destroy all the Lizarmed starting at Lustria.
- Now The Dreadfleet has to hold Galleon's Graveyard, Vampire Coast and Sartosa to achieve a Short Victory
- Now Pirates of Sartosa is not required to hold any specific territory outside of Sartosa.
- The number of sacked/lootet settlements of Pirates of Sartosa has been pushed from 15 to 25 for a Short Victory.
- The number of sacked/lootet settlements of Pirates of Sartosa has been pushed from 30 to 40for a Short Victory.
Last edited by Wolfy; 9 Jun, 2020 @ 4:03am
#2
Wolfy  [developer] 9 Jun, 2020 @ 4:01am 
@cybvep

Also, could you specify which Provinces/Factions should be required for The Short/Long Victory of The Drowned, The Awakened and The Dreadfleet? If not, I have to check manually the game to write down all the names and it takes a lot of time.
#3
cybvep 9 Jun, 2020 @ 6:45am 
- The number of sacked/lootet settlements of Pirates of Sartosa has been pushed from 30 to 40for a Short Victory.
You probably meant long victory here.

Also, could you specify which Provinces/Factions should be required for The Short/Long Victory of The Drowned, The Awakened and The Dreadfleet? If not, I have to check manually the game to write down all the names and it takes a lot of time.
Unfortunately, I have to check that manually as well.

THE AWAKENED

Lustrian coastline (note that only control should be required, which doesn't have to mean direct ownership):
- Vampire Coast and Volanic Islands provinces (they are port-only)
- Temple of Tlencan from the Northern Great Jungle province
- Chupayotl and Mangrove Coast from the Headhunter's Jungle
- Temple of Kara from the Creeping Jungle
- The High Sentinel and Monument of the Moon from the Southern Jungles of Pahualaxa
- Swamp Town and Port Reaver from the Northern Jungles of Pahualaxa
- Skeggi and Zigguart of Dawn from the Isthmus of Lustria

Lizardmen factions in Lustria that should be destroyed:
- Itza
- Cult of Sotek
- Sentinels of Xeti (maybe this one should be skipped for short victory, considering their remote location in the westernmost part of Lustria)
- Hexoatl
- Tlaxtlan

There is also Nakai (Spirit of the Jungle), but he is a horde and I don't think that Luthor should care about him that much as far as the short victory is concerned.
Last edited by cybvep; 9 Jun, 2020 @ 7:00am
#4
cybvep 9 Jun, 2020 @ 7:21am 
THE DROWNED

High Elven factions on Ulthuan that should be destroyed:
- Eataine
- Caledor
- Saphery
- Yvresse
- Avelorn
- Ellyrion
- Tiranoc
- Cothique
- Chrace

Looking at the number of High Elven factions and considering how strong they usually are, I think that requiring full destruction of *all* of them for a short victory may be PITA for the player, but should be fine for long victory. For short victory, I propose: Eataine, Caledor, Saphery, Ellyrion.

Thinking about it now, same can be said about the Ulthuan coast. Therefore, for short victory I propose the control of the following settlements: Lothern, Port Elistor, Angerrial, Whitefire Tor, Evershale. Those are the port regions of the inner ring of Ulthuan. If she controls them and achieves other stuff from her VCs (like infamy, destruction of factions etc.), then I call that a victory.

THE DREADFLEET

For short victory, he should be required to control:
- Vampire Coast
- Sartosa
- Galleon's Graveyard

The rest seems fine to me, considering other requirements (infamy, destruction of factions etc.).
Last edited by cybvep; 9 Jun, 2020 @ 7:26am
#5
cybvep 9 Jun, 2020 @ 11:35am 
BTW this is not strictly about the Vampire Pirates, but since Lokhir is heavily involved in their storyline in-game and is also a raider, not a classic empire builder, IMO his hold X provinces VC could be removed altogether. However, his capture X battle captives could be boosted to 20k for short victory and 40k for the long victory. Other VCs of the Blessed Dread seem fine. The landmark requirements basically mean that you have to achieve something in the game and that is good.
Last edited by cybvep; 9 Jun, 2020 @ 11:35am
#6
Wolfy  [developer] 9 Jun, 2020 @ 12:31pm 
Updated the Changelog. Can you check it?

## [1.2.0] The Pirates Update - TBA

- All "Hold X provinces" objectives have been deleted from the Vampire Coast factions
- The infamy required for all the Vampire Coast Short Victories has been updated from 6000 to 15000
- The infamy required for all the Vampire Coast Long Victories has been updated from 10000 to 25000
- Now The Awakened do not have to conquer all Lustria but just the external coast
- Vampire Coast and Volanic Islands full provinces (they are port-only)
- Temple of Tlencan from the Northern Great Jungle province
- Chupayotl and Mangrove Coast from the Headhunter's Jungle
- Temple of Kara from the Creeping Jungle
- The High Sentinel and Monument of the Moon from the Southern Jungles of Pahualaxa
- Swamp Town and Port Reaver from the Northern Jungles of Pahualaxa
- Skeggi and Zigguart of Dawn from the Isthmus of Lustria
- Now The Awakened have to destroy all the Lizarmed starting at Lustria
- Itza, Cult of Sotek, Sentinels of Xeti, Hexoatl, Tlaxlan
- Now The Drowned do not have to conquer all Ulthuan but just the internal coast to achieve a Short Victory
- Lothern, Port Elistor, Angerrial, Whitefire Tor, Evershale
- Now The Drowned have to destroy some of the Ulthuan starting factions to achieve a Short Victory
- Eataine, Caledor, Saphery, Ellyrion
- Now The Drowned have to destroy all the Ulthuan starting factions to achieve a Long Victory
- Eataine, Caledor, Saphery, Yvresse, Avelorn, Ellyrion, Tiranoc, Cothique, Chrace
- Now The Dreadfleet has to hold Galleon's Graveyard, Vampire Coast and Sartosa to achieve a Short Victory
- Now Pirates of Sartosa is not required to hold any specific territory outside of Sartosa
- The number of sacked/looted settlements of Pirates of Sartosa has been pushed from 15 to 25 for a Short Victory
- The number of sacked/looted settlements of Pirates of Sartosa has been pushed from 30 to 40 for a Long Victory
- The Blessed Dread Short Victory "Hold X provinces" objective has been removed
- The number of captives required by the The Blessed Dread Short Victory has been pushed to 20k
- The number of captives required by the The Blessed Dread Long Victory has been pushed to 40k
Last edited by Wolfy; 9 Jun, 2020 @ 12:31pm
#7
Wolfy  [developer] 9 Jun, 2020 @ 12:35pm 
Format has been lost by the ♥♥♥♥♥♥ Steam text parser. Quote it to see it in a more human-friendly way.

I have some doubts about the Awakened differences between a Short and a Long Victory. Also about the Drowned Long Victory, what part of Ulthuan do they need to conquer? Isn't it more logical to keep the external than the internal for the short victory? It is like more open to the open sea.
#8
cybvep 9 Jun, 2020 @ 1:07pm 
Well, Cylostra has the landmark building in Lothern which she has to build, so she has to take Lothern, anyway. If you include all the external port regions on Ulthuan for short campaign, it will take much longer (look at the map). She wants to sink Ulthuan, for that she needs to get to the inner circle. For the long victory, she would need to control all port regions on Ulthuan, not just 5.

Sentinels of Xeti can be dropped for short victory for Luthor, because they are in the most remote place, but kept for the long victory. Destruction of Nakai can also be added for the long victory, as well as the other Vampire Coast factions (The Drowned, Pirates of Sartosa and the Dreadfleet) so that Luthor is the master of the oceans.

In Vanilla for the long victory Luthor is required to destroy Last Defenders and Teotiqua as well. They are literally on the other side of the map and you cannot just sail there, but have to make a grind by land. Maybe Tlaqua would be a better choice here instead, because they are in the Southlands. But then, it's a long victory, so not such a big deal if it's... long.
Last edited by cybvep; 9 Jun, 2020 @ 1:09pm
#9
Wolfy  [developer] 9 Jun, 2020 @ 2:06pm 
Originally posted by cybvep:
Well, Cylostra has the landmark building in Lothern which she has to build, so she has to take Lothern, anyway. If you include all the external port regions on Ulthuan for short campaign, it will take much longer (look at the map). She wants to sink Ulthuan, for that she needs to get to the inner circle. For the long victory, she would need to control all port regions on Ulthuan, not just 5.

How do you feel about a victory objective based on owning at least 5 ports of Ulthuan (For a Short Victory). That way, the player chooses what its better based on its current campaign status.

I agree with all the other stuff.
#10
cybvep 9 Jun, 2020 @ 2:11pm 
I like it a lot! Quite flexible.

If Luthor's control the coast objective seems too long/grindy for the short campaign, something similar can be done to his short victory objectives so that he has to control MOST of the Lustrian coast instead of all of it. He should definitely always be required to keep the Vampire Coast.
Last edited by cybvep; 9 Jun, 2020 @ 2:17pm
#11
Wolfy  [developer] 10 Jun, 2020 @ 8:15am 
So, I have the set defined to prepare the update. These are the changes that are going to be introduced:

## [1.2.0] The Pirates Update - TBA - All "Hold X provinces" objectives have been deleted from the Vampire Coast factions - The infamy required for all the Vampire Coast Short Victories has been updated from 6000 to 15000 - The infamy required for all the Vampire Coast Long Victories has been updated from 10000 to 25000 - The Awakened now have to control at least 8 regions of the external coast of Lustria to achieve a Short Victory - The Awakened now have to control the external coast of Lustria to achieve a Long Victory - Now The Awakened have to destroy some of the Lizarmed starting at Lustria to achieve a Short Victory - Itza, Cult of Sotek Hexoatl, Tlaxlan - Now The Awakened have to destroy more factions achieve a Long Victory - Itza, Cult of Sotek, Sentinels of Xeti, Hexoatl, Tlaxlan, Nakai, The Drowned, Pirates of Sartosa, The Dreadfleet - The number of units required by The Awakened to achieve a Short Victory has been reduced to 60 - The number of units required by The Awakened to achieve a Long Victory has been reduced to 100 - Now The Drowned conquer at least five provinces of Ulthuan to achieve a Short Victory - Now The Drowned conquer all Ulthuan to achieve a Long Victory - Now The Drowned have to destroy some of the Ulthuan starting factions to achieve a Short Victory - Eataine, Caledor, Saphery, Ellyrion - Now The Drowned have to destroy all the Ulthuan starting factions to achieve a Long Victory - Eataine, Caledor, Saphery, Yvresse, Avelorn, Ellyrion, Tiranoc, Cothique, Chrace - Now The Dreadfleet has to hold Galleon's Graveyard, Vampire Coast and Sartosa to achieve a victory - Now Pirates of Sartosa is not required to hold any specific territory outside of Sartosa - The number of sacked/looted settlements of Pirates of Sartosa has been pushed from 15 to 25 for a Short Victory - The number of sacked/looted settlements of Pirates of Sartosa has been pushed from 30 to 40 for a Long Victory - The Blessed Dread Short Victory "Hold X provinces" objective has been removed - TBD The number of captives required by the The Blessed Dread Short Victory has been pushed to 20k - TBD The number of captives required by the The Blessed Dread Long Victory has been pushed to 40k
Last edited by Wolfy; 10 Jun, 2020 @ 8:15am
#12
Wolfy  [developer] 10 Jun, 2020 @ 8:17am 
And these are the updated READMEs.

## Vampire Coast ### The Awakened * **Short Victory Conditions**: * Earn 15000 infamy * Capture 8 of the following regions * The Awakening, Pox Marsh, The Blood Swamps, The Star Tower, Fuming Serpent, Temple of Tlecan, Chupayotl, Mangrove Coast, Temple of Kara, The High Sentinel, Monument of the Moon, Swamp Town, Port Reaver, Skaeggi, Ziggurat of Dawn * Destroy factions * Itza, Cult of Sotek Hexoatl, Tlaxlan * Construct The Awakened Landmark and the Special Deck * Own at least 60 units * Repair Harkons mind * **Long Victory Conditions**: * Earn 25000 infamy * Capture regions * The Awakening, Pox Marsh, The Blood Swamps, The Star Tower, Fuming Serpent, Temple of Tlecan, Chupayotl, Mangrove Coast, Temple of Kara, THe High Sentinel, Monument of the Moon, Swamp Town, Port Reaver, Skaeggi, Ziggurat of Dawn * Destroy factions * Itza, Cult of Sotek, Sentinels of Xeti, Hexoatl, Tlaxlan, Nakai, The Drowned, Pirates of Sartosa, The Dreadfleet * Construct The Awakened Landmark and the Special Deck * Own at least 100 units * Repair Harkons mind ### The Dreadfleet * **Short Victory Conditions**: * Earn 15000 infamy * Control provinces * Galleon's Graveyard, Vampire Coast, Sartosa * Destroy factions * The Blessed Dread, Pirates of Sartosa, Vampire Coast, The Drowned * Construct the Wreck of the Heldenhammer and the Special Deck * Own at least 3 Necrofex Colossus * **Long Victory Conditions**: * Earn 25000 infamy * Control provinces * Galleon's Graveyard, Vampire Coast, Sartosa * Destroy factions * The Blessed Dread, Pirates of Sartosa, Vampire Coast, The Drowned, Empire, Bretonnia, Vampire Counts, Schwartzhafen, The Barrow Legion, Followers of Nagash * Construct the Wreck of the Heldenhammer and the Special Deck * Own at least 6 Necrofex Colossus ### Pirates of Sartosa * **Short Victory Conditions**: * Earn 15000 infamy * Destroy factions * The Awakened, The Dreadfleet, Norsca * Sack/loot 25 settlements * Construct the Dragon Tooth Lighthouse and the Special Deck * Capture 8000 battle captives * Construct 3 tier 5 ports * Earn 6000 from raiding * **Long Victory Conditions**: * Earn 25000 infamy * Destroy factions * The Awakened, The Dreadfleet, Norsca, Wintertooth, The Drowned, The Blessed Dread * Sack/loot 40 settlements * Construct the Dragon Tooth Lighthouse and the Special Deck * Capture 15000 battle captives * Construct 6 tier 5 ports * Earn 10000 from raiding ### The Drowned * **Short Victory Conditions**: * Earn 15000 infamy * Capture 5 provinces of the following: * Caledor, Eataine, Tiranoc, Ellyrion, Avelorn, Saphery, Yvresse, Cothique, Chrace, Nagarythe, Eagle Gate, Griffon Gate, Phoenix Gate, Unicorn Gate * Destroy factions * Eataine, Caledor, Saphery, Ellyrion * Construct builings * Cylostra Opera House, Ship Cylostra * Own 10 Syreen / Mourngul * Own 3 Mourngul Haunters * **Long Victory Conditions**: * Earn 25000 infamy * Capture provinces: * Caledor, Eataine, Tiranoc, Ellyrion, Avelorn, Saphery, Yvresse, Cothique, Chrace, Nagarythe, Eagle Gate, Griffon Gate, Phoenix Gate, Unicorn Gate * Destroy factions * Eataine, Caledor, Saphery, Yvresse, Avelorn, Ellyrion, Tiranoc, Cothique, Chrace * Construct builings * Cylostra Opera House, Ship Cylostra * Own 20 Syreen / Mourngul * Get 3 Mourngul Haunters to level 20 ### The Blessed Dread * **Short Victory Conditions**: * Destroy factions: * Vampire Coast, Order of Loremasters, Clan Pestilenes * Construct 2 of the following special buildings: * Fiery Pits of Sacrifice, Slave Traders' Palaces, The Black Tower of Malekith, Vandalised Court of the Everqueen, The Maelstrom (Raging), Sanctum of Quintex, Shrine of Widowmaker * Capture 20000 battle captives * Own 3 Black Arks * Own 20 Black Ark Corsairs * **Long Victory Conditions**: * Destroy factions: * Vampire Coast, Order of Loremasters, Clan Pestilenes, Eataine, Avelorn, Noctilus, Nagarythe * Construct 5 of the following special buildings: * Fiery Pits of Sacrifice, Slave Traders' Palaces, The Black Tower of Malekith, Vandalised Court of the Everqueen, The Maelstrom (Raging), Sanctum of Quintex, Shrine of Widowmaker * Capture 40000 battle captives * Own 3 Gargantuan Black Arks * Own 30 Black Ark Corsairs
Last edited by Wolfy; 10 Jun, 2020 @ 8:17am
#13
Wolfy  [developer] 10 Jun, 2020 @ 11:00am 
Hi @cybvep

Can you check The Dreadfleet Long Victory Conditions (Destroy factions: Too much?) and the Pirates of Sartosa Victory Conditions (Destroy factions: Does Norsca make sense?)

Also, I would need your help to test this update, as I do not own the DLC.
#14
cybvep 10 Jun, 2020 @ 11:12am 
I like it. Each faction has its own style. ATM the only thing I think that could be added is the destroy Bordelaux objective for Noctilus (both short and long victory). He has the easiest time out of all Vampire Coast factions for short victory and Alberic can be considered a pirate hunter, so it seems fitting.

Norsca makes perfect sense for Aranessa. She hates the Norscans.

BTW as far as "destroy faction" objective is concerned, keep in mind that sometimes the AI does your work for you. Some of the factions will most likely be destroyed long before you reach them.
Last edited by cybvep; 10 Jun, 2020 @ 11:15am
#15
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