Just roughly read through and basically agree with your idea, but what happens if aeldari, militarum and other factions other weapons comes into the play?

Also, in lore-wise, maybe bolter can have 90% armor penetration, but if you put it into rimworld straight-forwardly, most of the 40k weapons will have nearly 100%+ armor penetration which makes most of the vanilla armors meaningless.

Although we are playing the era far earlier than 40k, we can't simply say 5k's technologies are all inferior to 40k's technology. Moreover, actually, the technologies of current rimworld state is more close to the dark age of technology, where far much superior than of 40k's.

Still, I think your balancing is, if we only focus on 40k lore wide and ignore this is a mod for rimworld which needs to be a part of greater ecosystem with other mods, quite attractive to me as well, so if you don't mind, would you please draft your excel? I could possibly put your balancing as one of the option - although it may takes great time ;(

Aight, first of all, link:

https://1drv.ms/x/s!AnbBYahtdiNVjyr3PB_lsLXkgjWk

Second and now about the lore, rimworld is FAR behind DaoT, while 40k technology is inferior to DaoT tech, its still based upon it and carries its legacy, rimworld on itself fits with a tech world, but charge rifles are the best it can offer in terms of ammunition, which if you think about it, is something we already have, only that we havent miniaturized it yet, but its not a technology far from 2022.. While a bolter is a basic weapon of 40k and still outperforms any handheld weapon that we could use and not just because of their caliber.. And even if we talk about stronger weapons in the wargame, each point of AP would equal about 16% more chance to hit, so if we put a bolter on 90, even the strongest of the wargame weapon wouldnt have much more than 130% armor pen.. I konw that sounds ridiculous, but thats against astartes armor which is, at the end of the day, bestial..

Not saying all rimworld techonologies are worse, there is a lot of nanomachine stuff, but rimworlds got a problem with some sci-fi stuff being very high up there (like res nanites) yet people are running around in flak armor... The discrepancy is enormous in terms of actual equipment as in weapons and armor, so I think your mod fits perfectly as a higher tier.. I really dont think 40k stuff should live at the same level as base rimworld (also it makes things a bit ridiculous because it dilutes everything, so making it just above everything else, in my opinion fits perfectly.. Even something as simple as a catachan fang, which most people would say "well, its a sword.."isnt in 40k.. 40k has monomolecular edges on basically every faction and is a technology so widely used and so amazingly effective that even a catachan fang would outperform every rimworld blade, unless it has some weirdness to it like power weapons.. Of course there would be outliers as not every bayonet used by the GI would be monomolecular edge, thatd be insane in terms of logistics, but specialized groups like the catachan? Bet your ass they have it...

Think about it this way, even the most advanced power armor in rimworld makes you slow as ♥♥♥♥ and has nothing else but protection... 40k DaoT power armor kept you alive after something shot out your heart and could even teleport you to a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ planet on the other side of the solar system (im not joking, the tech used by gray knights to teleport is bsed on that), 40k power armpor armor (and im not even talking about astartes here), while an inferior version, can still check your vitals, keep you alive, make you move MUCH faster, can directly link to your brain and give feedback, and a big BIG list of improvements over the most advanced piece of armor tech in rimworld..

So, to summarize, rimworld is lacking in both weapons and armor that are on the same level as its other tech, like the nanites, so the 40k stuff (again, in my opinion and at the end of the day this is your mod and ill enjoy it however you go at it becuase, well, your job is amazing as ive said multiple times) would fit perfectly, not as a replacement but as an improvement on the base game (also giving a new ceiling to difficulty, you wouldnt get murderized by orks instantly as you start the game, but there is a point in which you are too strong.. 40k could be that other level, in which you have to fight your way through xeno scum and heretic devils and its just.. another tech level.. post industrial)

I think the best way to go about it is just make every weapon and armor from the 40k universe (and that it makes sense, again, bayonet example, or just clothing or metal simple armor) use the balancing (or something similar) that I provided, raising their cost too so that you dont have a day 3 raid with an astartes murderizing you, and make it be what it is to humanity in 40k... In which if you find a bolter in a "rim" world, like necromunda.. Then you are the big mammajamma... If you standarize the balancing like I proposed, the work would far less than just manually changing everything, just make standard issue astartes armor 175% sharp armor (and similar to cata master on the other stats) and balance around that using the stats from the codex.. Then you increase or lower stats based on the dice chance, considering that rimworld rolls a d100 and wargame a d6, every point of the d6 is worth around 16% chance, youve basically have the balancing already done for you by the wargame and only need to translate, using the standardized astartes in normal quality as a cata of masterwork to "relate" it to rimworld actual position..

The bar when compared to rimworld can be raised or lowered of course, you could say that an astartes is a cata of excelent quality instead as an example, but the rest of the mechanics for balancing would remain the same and only "translation" work would be needed..

Of course if you do go for such a balancing feat and if you mind, I would try to help out as much as possible on your github following whatever formula you end up wanting to use..

Again, thanks for reading and for the hardwork you put into this <3

Originally posted by Silver Wolf 00:

Aight, first of all, link:

https://1drv.ms/x/s!AnbBYahtdiNVjyr3PB_lsLXkgjWk

Of course if you do go for such a balancing feat and if you mind, I would try to help out as much as possible on your github following whatever formula you end up wanting to use..

Again, thanks for reading and for the hardwork you put into this <3

It does make sense. Well, fortunately, we do have toggable option from Vanilla Expanded Framework, so I think we can use multiple, different balancing for this mod. In that sense, I'm open to any concept, because, in the end, the game you are playing is yours, not mine.

Let me have a time and do that, hopefully, before the Christmas :)

Oh, and just for your information, you can see how does my balancing works on here;

https://zirbel-my.sharepoint.com/:x:/g/personal/emitbreaker_zirbel_onmicrosoft_com/EatkrE-oGEBKn3Hriq7qWrkBxzgJDRJXIliWsSRCqqxUEw?e=3xIZcM

Damn thats a nice spreadsheet ahahah Take your time, enjoy your process my man, and dont work too much before Christmas, just the updating work was enough, balancing is just the icing on the cake and can be done whenever you want! I'm glad to be helpful and I'm looking forward for everything you do :D

I'm going to agree that bolters should explode and not pierce. You stated you didn't want space marines to hide behind cover, well, if you've played Darktide you know that space marines aren't the only ones who use bolters.

Originally posted by Nezmith:

I'm going to agree that bolters should explode and not pierce. You stated you didn't want space marines to hide behind cover, well, if you've played Darktide you know that space marines aren't the only ones who use bolters.

Don't make things too much simplify, if you want to talk about lore. From the lore wide, Militarum uses completely different Bolters with Astartes.

Besides, that's another point I'm considering - how to differentiate those of Militarum / Sororitas and Astartes in terms of the weapons which has same name but in fact pretty much different in terms of its design or size.

Did you really ban me from the main thread for that? Just wow. Yeah, I won't write bug reports for you, either.

I'll just add a couple things to justify myself once and for all.

Firstly, you asked for opinions and I gave mine. If you don't want the 'wrong' opinion, don't ask for opinions.

Secondly, if Gunnery Sergeant Harker can throw a heavy bolter around like it's no big deal, I assume my colonists with advanced bionics can, too. So can bigger orks and a variety of other creatures, modded or not.