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Victoria 3 >  Workshop > CaelReader's Workshop > Queer Rights > Discussions
Queer Rights
Description Discussions4 Comments68 Change Notes
CaelReader  [developer] 23 Nov, 2023 @ 2:34pm
1836 Law Settings
Here's the current Queer Rights law settings on game start:
Sodomy Laws are the default for all nations.
All decentralized nations get Homosexuality Decriminalized.
The decentralized nations in Polynesia and North America start with Queer Rights.
The following nations also get Homosexuality Decriminalized:
France, Haiti, Luxembourg, Belgium, Netherlands, Krakow, Brazil, Bolivia, Japan, Ottoman Empire, Egypt, Korea, Burma, Persia, Siam, Hawaii, Indian Territory.

Hawaii and Indian Territory would culturally have Queer Rights, but as a centralized nation the bar for Queer Rights is higher. In a centralized nation, Queer Rights represents an explicit legal framework and status, which is lacking in these states.

Hawaii is undergoing christianization in 1836 and historically will pass a very severe sodomy law in 1850. AI Hawaii will try to do so if an anti-queer IG comes to power.
Last edited by CaelReader; 10 Dec, 2023 @ 11:56pm
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Showing 1-2 of 2 comments
EinZwei 7 Dec, 2023 @ 7:48pm 
In literally reading wikipedia, here are some suggestions for law changes:
Qing: Homosexuality Decriminalized; while the qing were the first to put punishment for sodomy on the books, it was still widely practiced and the punishment was the least severe punishment possible in the legal system, with Sodomy Laws only being enacted post 1861 in their efforts to Westernize. You have both Japan and Korea so idk why Qing was left out
Siam: I can't find any specific information on the laws during V3's timeline, but in ancient history it was widely accepted, so I would suggest Homosexuality Decriminalized, if not Same-Sex marriage if it can be proven.
Decentralized Nations in Papua New Guinea, Polynesia & New Zealand: Queer Rights! Pre-colonization, these societies either had strong cultures of homosexual partnerships or even third genders.
Hawaii: Queer rights, for similar reasons above, but it's not decentralized.
Persia: Homosexuality Decriminalized; while Sharia law denounced it, it was common and only officially criminalized in 1914, though reports at the time didn't hear about any actual convictions.
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CaelReader  [developer] 10 Dec, 2023 @ 10:29pm 
Originally posted by EinZwei:
In literally reading wikipedia, here are some suggestions for law changes:
Qing: Homosexuality Decriminalized; while the qing were the first to put punishment for sodomy on the books, it was still widely practiced and the punishment was the least severe punishment possible in the legal system, with Sodomy Laws only being enacted post 1861 in their efforts to Westernize. You have both Japan and Korea so idk why Qing was left out
Siam: I can't find any specific information on the laws during V3's timeline, but in ancient history it was widely accepted, so I would suggest Homosexuality Decriminalized, if not Same-Sex marriage if it can be proven.
Decentralized Nations in Papua New Guinea, Polynesia & New Zealand: Queer Rights! Pre-colonization, these societies either had strong cultures of homosexual partnerships or even third genders.
Hawaii: Queer rights, for similar reasons above, but it's not decentralized.
Persia: Homosexuality Decriminalized; while Sharia law denounced it, it was common and only officially criminalized in 1914, though reports at the time didn't hear about any actual convictions.

Thanks for the suggestions!

I will update Siam and Persia to have Decriminalized, and the polynesian nations to have Queer Rights. Hawaii is an interesting case because it looks like they had queer rights to start but passed a pretty severed sodomy law in 1850 (Penal Code of Hawaii 1850). I might add an explicit event for them about that.

On further research, I found an article detailing chinese anti-sodomy laws going all the way back to the Song dynasty, so I'm going to leave Qing as having Sodomy Laws. (Sommer, Matthew H. “The Penetrated Male in Late Imperial China)
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