Crusader Kings III

Crusader Kings III

Blood of Valyria - A AGOT Submod
baptoun  [developer] 26 Apr @ 11:35am
Answer to @bennus8
Thank you very much for your comment!

I'll answer your question about Orys, the Celtigars, and Velaryon in one fell swoop. To understand the reason, you have to understand why I created this mod. Originally, I was playing with the mod that adds the bookmark of Aegon's conquest, and I wanted to create a pure Valyrian bloodline.
And there are some questions I asked myself:
-Why was Orys considered a Baratheon? He founded House Baratheon by marrying Argella; he should have been, at best, a bastard Targaryen, and at worst, a commoner (possibly with Aerion as his secret father). (So this isn't a bug. Is Orys really a Targaryen before his marriage to Argella, or Aegon's coronation? I have my doubts.)
-Then, why did the great Valyrian families follow the Faith of the Seven? We know that they converted shortly before the Conquest, so it seemed strange that they converted seven years before the Conquest.
-Why were the Celtigars considered Valyrians of Westeros, and not High Valyrians?

So, in order to carry out my pure-blood Valyrian project, I created a first submod that included the previous additions (Orys a Targaryen before his marriage to Argella, the Valyrian families who converted during Aegon's coronation, and the Celtigars as High Valyrians). I then published this submod, and was asked to add the Scales as High Valyrian (which I did).

So, once this first submod was created, I played around (with my idea of ​​creating a pure Valyrian lineage). Then I realized it was impossible, because it would require checking the culture of each character's ancestors, haha. Then, while playing, I thought to myself: but why does my grandson (my son's son), who is a Martell, take a huge inbreeding penalty if he marries his cousin, but not my other Targaryen grandson? Then, one thing led to another, I came to wonder why the Targaryens (and by extension Velaryon and Celtigar), would have a big bonus against inbreeding, while only having marriages with Andals (or other ethnic groups).
And that's how I started creating the mode. However, during creation, I based it on the files of my previous mode, and since it didn't seem irrelevant to me, I kept the changes. This was actually a major headache, because during the update to religions and Bravos, all the files were incompatible with AGOT, so I had to use a file comparator and compare each file.

Regarding Orys, whether I gave him 16 or 32/32 was a matter of reflection. Initially, in the game files, if only one parent appeared, I assigned the same trait to the child. But this led to several members of House Fell having 4 or 8/32 (I can't remember exactly) Valyrian blood, and this over several generations. So I decided that if only one parent appeared, then the child had half the trait (Gaemon and Trystan have 18 and 37% blood, whereas initially they had the same number as their father).
However, Orys was still a special case. Is Aerion his real father? Although the rumor is almost official, Aerion never acknowledged him. Perhaps he was just an "adopted" child (a bit like Gaemon with Aegon III, or he was taken into care)? I finally gave him a 32/32, because the impact on future generations would have been minimal (with the exception of Jocelyn, who had few marriages with Targaryens), and also because the Baratheons (according to my research) are often considered a Valyrian house, or rather "originally Valyrian," and population movements were likely low in Dragonstone before the conquest (they already aren't now).

As for the Scales, their "isolated" positions made them serve as a test family for me, haha. And also, before the addition of the game rules that allow characters who spwan one of the traits, it was a spare tire to allow players to play with this gameplay in the last bookmarks. I plan to remove their Valyrian blood as soon as I have the time (I must admit, given their rank and importance within Westeros, it's not my priority).


As for the founders of the Velaryons and Celtigar houses, I don't agree (sorry). We know (from HOTD) that the Velaryons are even older than the Targaryens. And the Valeryens were attached to the purity of their blood, even if the Velaryons and Celtigar are not overpowering families, they are not beggars. The surrounding peoples having been enslaved, I therefore do not see them marrying members of enslaved families. Also, who says that even if they never rode a dragon, that they were never mostly married to dragonrider houses?

Regarding making traits improve if they're repeated over a few generations, I've thought about it, but not to such a low degree, but rather if the parents and grandparents only have traits of the 31 or 30/32 type, in order to allow the child to be 32/32.

The justification for this, for me, is that Rhaegar, Viserys, and Daenerys are the very image of madness.
Rhaegar: A man who, in the worst case scenario, abandons his wife and children to rape a 16-year-old girl (he's 23), and in the best case scenario, abandons her to pursue an affair with a young girl? Either way, it's a bit pedophile-like.
Daenerys: She does nothing to prevent her brother from being killed (okay, he wasn't perfect, but he loved her). Who decides to go into a pyre, convinced that she'll come out with dragons? Well, that reminds me of the story of a guy who drank the green potion (thinking he'd become a dragon), and that of a man who thought burning his town would also turn him into a dragon. Who then thinks she's the mother of his dragons (one really has to wonder if she thinks so). And who thinks her destiny is to free the slaves no matter what.
All these reasons make it clear to me that this is truly the madness of inbreeding.

Feel free to reply, or contact me privately if you want to discuss it further! Thanks again for your comment!
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bennuss8 26 Apr @ 4:06pm 
Thanks for such a detailed response, I appreciate it, and thank you again for making this submod, I see myself using it in all my playthroughs moving forward! I totally see where you're coming from, and I definitely agree about the effects of inbreeding, I'm more so looking at it in terms of the "keeping the bloodline pure" logic that seems to apply to Valyrian dragonriders. Everything else makes total sense, I'm sorry if any of my questions/comments came off as critical, it was all out of curiosity.
baptoun  [developer] 26 Apr @ 6:19pm 
Originally posted by bennuss8:
Thanks for such a detailed response, I appreciate it, and thank you again for making this submod, I see myself using it in all my playthroughs moving forward! I totally see where you're coming from, and I definitely agree about the effects of inbreeding, I'm more so looking at it in terms of the "keeping the bloodline pure" logic that seems to apply to Valyrian dragonriders. Everything else makes total sense, I'm sorry if any of my questions/comments came off as critical, it was all out of curiosity.

@bennuss8
Thank you very much!!
I hope I have time to improve it. My first major goal is to assign traits to all the missing characters who come from smaller lineages.
Then, I'll implement traits for Legacy of Valyria characters (my mod is compatible with it, but no traits are assigned to LoV characters). I've never played Agot Alessian Dynasty, but I'd like to do the same as with LoV (I currently don't know if my mod is compatible with it).
Then I'd like to add some flavor elements, such as language-related elements (making High Valyrian no longer the Valyrian language, to match the series, and creating events around that), etc.
Currently, the next gameplay addition that should be coming is a game rule (disabled by default) that allows you to kill all dragons (and therefore disable them) when starting a new game.

Don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions :)
And thanks again for your support!!
Hi, I just wanted to join this discussion. I really love the mod, but I found out that the dragon blood trait doesn't become stronger if you intermarry. And I think that's not entirely right.

The whole reason that Targaryens had incestuous unions was to keep the blood pure, and to keep the dragon blood strong in their offspring.

Especially at the end of the Targaryen line I think the dragonblood had been reinforced with Rhaegar and Daenerys.

Rhaegar was called 'the Last Dragon', he also was extremely intelligent and seemed to have some degree of prophetic knowledge. I think he had a very, very good reason to run off with Lyanna.
Daenerys saw him and Elia in the House of the Undying, where he said something about "the dragon has three heads". Seemingly knowing he needed to sire three Targaryens to fulfill the song of Ice and Fire.
It is speculated that because of Elia's frail health, she wasn't able to give him a third child.

Daenerys also had dragon dreams before she hatched her dragons.
I think dragon dreams have a lot to do with the purity of the dragonblood.

Blaming the Targaryen insanity on lack of dragonblood in later generations doesn't seem right to me. Maegor 'the cruel' was also insane, and he was the son of Aegon the conqueror and Visenya, giving him 100% dragon blood. I just think their insanity is just some sort of inherent trait.

Aerion 'Brightflame' for instance was the one who drank the wildfire and was quite insane and cruel during his life. His parents were Maekar and Dyanna Dayne. Not an incestuous union. His grandparents were Daeron II and Myriah Martell. Also not incestuous.


I would love it if there would be a blood purity reinforcement implemented in the mod. I also recommend that not all children will be born with reinforced dragon blood. Because I do think that Viserys didn't have a lot of it. That also adds a fun game mechanic, that marrying brother to sister doesn't automatically mean that the dragon blood will always come out stronger.

As a final note I just want to compliment you because I do love the idea of weakening their dragon blood and increasing the chance of inbreeding if they stray too much from intermarrying. It makes the playing dynamic more interesting!
baptoun  [developer] 3 May @ 7:08pm 
Originally posted by joost3006:
Hi, I just wanted to join this discussion. I really love the mod, but I found out that the dragon blood trait doesn't become stronger if you intermarry. And I think that's not entirely right.

@joost3006
Thank you very much for your comment!! And sorry for not replying sooner.
Regarding the fact that blood doesn't strengthen, I've heard a lot about it. The problem is that I don't have a "scientific" way to explain it.

Regarding madness, it's true that there's the case of Aerion. Honestly, when I was creating the mode, I thought about it, but I told myself that no one would notice, haha 😅😅
As for Maegor, I never thought he was crazy, just rude, haha.

For now, my mode doesn't include events related to inbreeding, which means that "Targaryen madness" remains the same as in the base mode. However, I would like to modify it in the future so that it's linked to inbreeding (but that seems impossible to do from a coding perspective).

As for your last idea, I've already thought about this, and it was also pointed out to me on Discord. It would have taken the form where the child could have a dragon trait somewhere between the two parents, and not just the average (e.g., the parents have traits 32/32 and 16/32; normally, the child would have 24/32; then they would have an equal chance of having any of the two). However, the problem is that the mode currently works with a combination system. There are approximately 1088 combinations (e.g., the father has the 20/32 trait, and the mother has the 24/32 trait). This would mean coding at least 1088 new combinations, and with much more work because it would require coding the chances that the child would inherit a particular trait for each one, and not just stating that they inherit a trait. (I don't know if I made myself clear).

Currently, I don't have the energy to do such a huge amount of work. Making the current combinations took me a good 1-2 months. My current goal is to work on content such as hatching ceremonies and flavors based on lore and real story content.

So, thanks again for your comment. Sorry for the late reply. Don't hesitate to ask if you have any other recommendations or questions!!
@joost3006
Thank you very much for your comment!! And sorry for not replying sooner.
Regarding the fact that blood doesn't strengthen, I've heard a lot about it. The problem is that I
don't have a "scientific" way to explain it.

Oh don't worry about your response time! This is perfectly fine!
I was just venting out my view on their dragonblood through how I think the world lore of the AGOT universe works.
I'm not familiar whatsoever with coding or anything so I didn't have a clue how much time goes in this! Which makes your work on this mod all the more impressive!

For the time being I'm also enjoying the mod as is, and I tweak their dragonblood traits with the remove and add trait cheat whenever I want certain characters to have reinforced dragonblood or not.
Love the responseee. I had just wanted to add, doesn't make it okay these days or in general but in Rhaegar's defense age 15/16 is of age in Westeros so Rhaegar wouldn't have been see as pedo with running off with Lyana. Remember Robert was like the same age if not older than Rhaegar and no one blinked about him simping for her.

oh oh! can you give me a quick note way calcute the blood math please? I am dumb when it comes to math-ing haha. like how can I make it go up or like if I mixed a 18/32 with a 1/32?
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