XCOM 2
CP G.I. Joe
The_Man_In_The_Shack  [developer] 29 Apr, 2017 @ 10:35am
Conceptual Character Builds
Hi guys, so I wanted to have a particular thread that is about hammering out the builds for a mod that would go along with this one to give each guy their own custom class. I'm closing in on having the perks organized properly, at this point, and I wanted to kind of run through my thought process.

Here is the list that I'm working with right now, with proposed Primary/Secondary weapons. They are broken into groups of similar jobs, or similar concepts. Would love any feedback/ideas. Do people have the right things? I want everything to have a good basis of 'why' it is included, but there are lots of potential reasons.

REGULAR INFANTRY
==========================
Hawk - Rifle/Pistol
Grunt - Rifle/Sawed-Off
Footloose - Rifle/Pistol
Lady Jaye - Rifle/Gremlin
Beach Head - Rifle/Knife
Iceberg - Rifle/Pistol
Hit & Run - Rifle/Knife
Blizzard - Rifle/Knife
Spearhead - Rifle/Knife

ASSAULT INFANTRY
==========================
Grand Slam - Shotgun/Sword (bat)
Duke - Rifle/Pistol
Dusty - Rifle/Sawed-Off
Flint - Shotgun/Knife
Shipwreck - Rifle/Gremlin

SNEAKY INFANTRY
==========================
Torpedo - SMG/Throwing
Recondo - Sniper/Knife
Spirit - Boltcaster/Knife
Falcon - Shotgun/Knife
Outback - Rifle/Knife
Muskrat - Shotgun/Sword
Recoil - Rifle/Knife

SPOTTERS
==========================
Stalker - SMG/Holotarget
Deep Six - SMG/Holotarget
Alpine - Sniper/Holotarget
Sneak Peek - Rifle/Holotarget
Ghostrider - SMG/Holotarget
Ambush - Sniper/Holotarget

SHOCK
==========================
Mutt - SMG/Arc
Law - SMG/Arc
Shockwave - Shotgun/Arc

PARATROOPERS
==========================
Airborne - Rifle/Knife
Ripcord - Rifle/Pistol
Crazylegs - Rifle/Pistol

DRIVERS
==========================
Clutch - Pistol/Sawed-Off
Crank Case - Rifle/Pistol
Skidmark - SMG/Pistol

GUNNERS
==========================
Rock & Roll - MG/Pistol
Roadblock - MG/Pistol
Leatherneck - MG/Knife
Repeater - MG/Sawed-Off

DEMOLITIONS
==========================
Tripwire - Rifle/Pistol
Tollbooth - Rifle/Rocket
Wet-Suit - Rifle/Knife
Tunnel Rat - MG/Knife
Lightfoot - Rifle/Pistol

SNIPERS
==========================
Flash - Sniper/Gremlin
Snow Job - Sniper/Pistol
Sci-Fi - Sniper/Holotarget
Low-Light - Sniper/Knife

ROCKETEERS
==========================
Zap - Rifle/Rocket
Bazooka - Rifle/Rocket
Fast Draw - SMG/Rocket

HEAVIES
==========================
Steeler - SMG/Rocket
Cover Girl - Rifle/Launcher
Cutter - Rifle/Launcher
Thunder - SMG/Launcher
Frostbite - MG/Rocket
Heavy Metal - SMG/Rocket
Cross-Country - MG/Rocket
Backstop - Rifle/Rocket
Armadillo - Rifle/Rocket
Wildcard - MG/Rocket
Long Range - Sniper/Rocket
Wild Bill - Pistol/Rocket
Ace - SMG/Rocket
Windmill - Rifle/Rocket

VOLATILES
==========================
Blowtorch - SMG/Flame
Airtight - Shotgun/Launcher
Charbroil - SMG/Flame

GRENADIERS
==========================
Short-Fuze - Rifle/Launcher
Gung-Ho - Pistol/Launcher
Hardball - Rifle/Launcher

MARTIAL ARTS
==========================
Scarlett - Boltcaster/Throwing
Snake-Eyes - SMG/Sword
Quick Kick - Sword/Throwing
Jinx - Sword/Gremlin
Budo - Sword/Pistol

HACKERS
==========================
Breaker - Rifle/Gremlin
Dial-Tone - Rifle/Gremlin
Mainframe - Rifle/Gremlin
Slip Stream - SMG/Gremlin

MEDIC/SUPPORT
==========================
Doc - Pistol/Gremlin
Barbecue - Rifle/Sword (Axe)
Lifeline - SMG/Gremlin
Lift Ticket - SMG/Gremlin

PSI
==========================
Chuckles - Pistol/Psi Amp
Psyche-Out - SMG/Psi Amp

Last edited by The_Man_In_The_Shack; 1 May, 2017 @ 4:55pm
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Showing 1-15 of 31 comments
Cynath 29 Apr, 2017 @ 10:54am 
I got Sigthline as my spotting holo-sniper, but he's a new inclusion so I just noticed you don't have him, moot point haha.
Why is JInx operating Gremlin?
The_Man_In_The_Shack  [developer] 29 Apr, 2017 @ 11:08am 
As Jinx is introduced in the comic, she is a hacker...she's the most prominent hacker aside from Mainframe, in fact. She should actually appear in that group, but I was keeping the Arashikages together. Flash is sort of the same way...he's a sniper and a hacker. The groups are kind of loose, really, just for gross organization...most characters fall into more than one.

I like Sightline! That's a good idea...I'll add him to the apocryphal group in the character pool...I'll make another update sometime soon. For now with this list though, I'm just doing the 'main' guys, which are pretty much the Joes used in the first hundred or so issues of the old comic series. If I can get this to work the way I want, expansions should be easy enough.
Last edited by The_Man_In_The_Shack; 29 Apr, 2017 @ 11:18am
LeMarteau 29 Apr, 2017 @ 5:18pm 
Great list. I'd give Law and Shockwave a SMG to fit the figure's weapons. I thought Slip Stream would have the rockets because of the X-30. Any reason for him having a gremlin and being a hacker? Comic book related?
LeMarteau 29 Apr, 2017 @ 5:28pm 
If you'd like to add other characters from later years, I'm about to release an update for my GI Joe Uniforms mod. There are many new characters that could be added as I continued to create Character builds for all six members of the Sky Patrol. I made non generic characters that are specific to the Steel Brigade. There are the "reinstated" er Joes: Mayday, Cross hair and Barrel Roll are very cool snipers ( I use the last two as specops). Sgt. Hacker is... well... a hacker. :) So, there is still much space to expand if you'd like.
Cynath 29 Apr, 2017 @ 5:50pm 
Also, I have Leatherneck as a gunner straight up. I am less of a purist changing some guys to a more modern, military version tho. My Wid Bill has a full beard, also :D
The_Man_In_The_Shack  [developer] 30 Apr, 2017 @ 5:41am 
I pretty much think of Leatherneck as a gunner as well...I should just move him to that grouping. But again, those groups are malleable, just kind of a guideline for us to think along.

Law=SMG is something I'm okay with. I had gone through in one of my sheets and listed out the specific real-world guns for almost everyone, and have pretty much gone by that list, though there are some where I cannot find the reference and I have inferred it from their job, and there are some where more than one thing makes sense. For e.g. Tunnel Rat, the M60 can work, but in many cases for him an SMG would make more sense. Some guys like him I think will have the choice. Some, like Spirit, need a custom weapon...in his case, he needs a boltcaster that has several rounds and does less damage. I'm sure there's a way to make that but I don't know what it is yet.

Did you see Destroyer's mustache pack that he released a few weeks ago? There's a giant mustache on there that works perfectly for Wild Bill. Bazooka also, and Dr. Mindbender. I'm wary of using it in too many places, but it's good for a few. Wild Bill in particular is one of my all-time favorites, so any time I can improve him I'm happy about it.

Regarding Slip-Stream, and the pilots in general, it's almost more about differentiating them from each other...I don't like the idea of Slip Stream and Ghostrider being too much like Ace. Slip Stream isn't so much a hacker per se, but he's a more 'technical' pilot than Ace, who is a more traditional dogfighter. Ghostrider, meanwhile, has the overwhelming character trait that he is just invisible all the time, to the point that the others can't remember his name (that was actually a Marvel-Comics-as-publisher joke back then, but then again most of these characters are in-jokes of one kind or another). I had Wild Bill without the Rocket too, and then changed my mind...I can definitely see Slip Stream with a rocket instead of a gremlin, but the question becomes how to emphasize his technical nature, differentiating him from Ace?

That's really what this comes down to, is making each guy feel unique from the guys that are pretty much the same. Grunt and Footloose, Iceberg and Blizzard, Recondo and Muskrat, Torpedo and Wet Suit, Clutch/Crankcase/Skidmark, Ace/Slip Stream/Ghostrider, Blowtorch/Charbroil...there are lots of these, and each one has an ideal build that makes them 'correct', but sometimes we need to dig to find the things that make them THEM instead of just another soldier. You see why I'm keeping the main list fairly small for now. :)

The_Man_In_The_Shack  [developer] 30 Apr, 2017 @ 5:51am 
Regarding Shockwave and the shotgun...honestly, here I'm looking for guys that would reasonably use the shotgun. Flint and Falcon are the two 'gimmes', for sure, along with Muskrat, and Clutch is going to be the guy who gets the sawed-off specialization. Airtight also carries a shotgun (that Renegades figure is one of the best), but he's not a shotgun-guy in the sense that he will get powers around it. Who else should/could be shotgun, for good reasons?

Shockwave seemed like a good candidate...his background as a SWAT breacher makes it a sensible thing for him to carry. I figure he's about shields to represent riot gear, and then about stunning, and being able to breach safely. Those sorts of powers would make him very cool and definitely unique among this group. Could he do that with an SMG? Probaby yeah...but there's only a few shotguns and a lot of guys carrying rifles.

Ideas along these lines?
LeMarteau 30 Apr, 2017 @ 5:57pm 
I like the shotgun for Shockwave. I usually play him as a LW2 Ranger so that he has a sawed-off when "breaching". SMG makes him go further because of his mobility, so that's the 'why' for me. I prefer not giving him an ARC. I give him a bunch of flashbangs. One of my favorites so I play him a lot. ;)

I'd see Shipwreck with a shotgun. Kind of a brute force. Not subtle. 'Loud'. A bit like him. I'll keep reflecting on candidates. I'm sure that I'm forgetting someone. Law might certainly use one as an MP, now that I think of it...

I'd give Mainframe a Pistol and a Gremlin, as he'd have superior hacking skills. That would make him a bit more unique.

I'd put Wet-Suit with Demoltions, for UDT. Same loadout that you bave. To me he's not regular infantry.

My Leatherneck is a generally a LW2 Ranger or the like, to serve as a shock trooper. MG is good too.

I'd also keep the main list for older characters and maybe include newer joes for a character pool.

For Slipstream, maybe SMG and rockets plus more mobility. Not sure... Stronger rockets but less ammo? Ace would have a high dodge and would be very difficult to hit. He could have more surgical strikes. Any of that making any sense? :)
LeMarteau 30 Apr, 2017 @ 6:16pm 
How about Barbecue having a primary axe and a gremlin? Good idea?
Cynath 30 Apr, 2017 @ 6:19pm 
well, can he still use a flamethrower?

also, Flint carries a shotty for me.

Shockwave as well, same deal, I actually gave him a taser, as it suits his SWAT background.
LeMarteau 30 Apr, 2017 @ 6:40pm 
Arc is okay for Shockwave. I had tried it but started using him less and not using the ARC, then I switched back to Ranger to have a more offensive, close quarters combat, version of Shockwave. I'm not against an ARC for him To me that SWAT is breaching and taking out bad guys. Last option. Incapacitating bad guys is also very valid in that case.

Law is ARC as he's a policeman. Mutt: animal control. Arc is great for him too.

I never give a flamethrower to Barbecue as he's a fireman. But he sure knows how to control fire. ;)
The_Man_In_The_Shack  [developer] 1 May, 2017 @ 4:54pm 
Yeah Barbecue is a hard one. I do want him to use the axe, so he should really have that instead of a gremlin. I'm changing it. I'm thinking of EMT abilities, which is why I had the gremlin there, but there's also guys like Stalker and Spirit who have medic without the drone. If the drones could put out fires, or if ANY ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ THING could put out fires, he'd have that...i still can't believe that no one has cracked that one. The other thing I think of with him is a deep knowledge of how structures get brought down, so I'm figuring he has destroy-cover type stuff. That's also Tollbooth's thing.
The_Man_In_The_Shack  [developer] 1 May, 2017 @ 4:58pm 
I'm also thinking that Grand Slam is a good shotgun candidate. Does anyone know if someone has distilled the suit-based powers, such that they could be added to a class? Grand Slam and Duke should have an Icarus Jump without having to have the suit (because they are both associated with the jet pack). Similarly, Alpine and Hit and Run should have the Spider Suit ropes just naturally.

BTW...the curated unique-perk list is now up to 373 entries! That's a crapload of perks!
Last edited by The_Man_In_The_Shack; 1 May, 2017 @ 4:59pm
The_Man_In_The_Shack  [developer] 6 May, 2017 @ 7:29am 
So, thinking about rockets, and things that seem like rockets. Aside from the gauntlet, there's also the old 'rocketeer' that was using the launcher instead, and there are a number of perks in many classes that give you different rockets. My question is...taking ACTUAL rockets out of consideration, what are some powers that might simulate rockets in a non-rocket person?

The Guerilla's 'Airburst Rounds' comes to mind first. The Tinkerer class has an 'Aegis bullet' that is a homing-stunner. I'm looking at those two and thinking that this is how to build Fast Draw in particular...I want to give him these things in addition to the regular gauntlet. Maybe Armadillo, because the Rolling Thunder has so much crap on it. And I was continuing to think about the Slip Stream question...can the X30 rockets be represented in another way, and still allow him to have the Gremlin for doing hacker stuff, since one of his things is piloting stuff by remote control...so I really want him to have Haywire Protocol.

What do you guys think? Other powers that might work in this way?
LeMarteau 6 May, 2017 @ 1:36pm 
Yes what you describe for airburst and aegis are nice choices for fast draw. Didn't try the latter.

The LW2 mod "more technical rockets" is pretty cool. It brings a nice variety. I personally use it for Salvo as a technical.

Rocketeer is something that I'd still use for Bazooka and Zap because of the launcher, but last time I checked it was broken in LW2. Might be good for the Rolling Thunder.

For Slip Stream something like the Archon's Blazing Pinions might do.
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