did it work @twins

ok cool, i want boarding actions to be useful actaully will tell ya if it works

Maybe, not sure. You could put it at the top of the loading order and try it out - it probably will work together.

does this mod work with DEI

Ok, well, it sounds like you don't like the mod then. Not sure what you might be expecting me to do?
Not being rude here, just saying that the mod is meant to make naval battles more clumsy and deliberate, and I am satisfied with how it behaves (not to mentioned, I have moved on to newer TW mods), but I recognize that it isn't for everyone's tastes.

and ships don't stop ether they slide, and wile realistic makes me want to die

i really have tried with this mod, but the speed is just awful the units love to do whatever they want to and arty ships cant handle shooting at anything as they just start spinning, i think the changes are nice but not being able to do basic functions just does not cut it

Thanks for the high praise. Glad you like it. Have fun!

I suppose it should, unless they also modified the naval combat.

does this work with dei? would fit so good in my campaigns

Yeah, that would be nice, but unfortunately the engine doesn't support anything like that - that is, it doesn't take into account your speed when turning. It's just a constant turn rate, unfortunately.

I've been loving this mod and recommending it far and wide, however I've just been struck by a soulcrushing realisation:

rowing ships should be able to turn on a dime by having one side row in reverse.

Thanks, glad you like it.

God bless you, this shitty ramming of vanilla is simply dumb, all fucking ai naval battles are just a bunch of bumper cars, thanks to you it is at least possible to play.

Yes, ramming is not as effective -- but you have to keep in mind that there are all sorts of ship related buffs in the campaign tech tree (increased hull strength, increased ramming strength) as well as buffs for naval generals and certain structures, and its all designed to where the buffs are necessary to be effective. Otherwise, yes, the naval battles will be sloppy and indecisive - especially when evenly matched (this is historical). Then factor in that the ship ramming is based on the mass of the ship, and the ship's speed - so a good ramming attack would be a larger ship using a speed burst ability.

The reason for that is to provide an incentive to get all the naval buffs, which to be honest, aren't attractive at all in the standard game. Now besides that, I am not saying its perfect but maybe one day I can revisit it to see if I can do something about the naval missile damage (that's probably the main thing I am not too happy about, but I believe there are buffs for that too).

I appreciate your work! The problem I have using this mod is the same as Claudius. My ships are barely responsive after a ram - I can't even move to board when my ships are side by side with the enemy ship (I wish we had the Empire, Shogun, Napoleon mechanics where sailors boarded ships from the side).

This mod makes fast firing missile ships (Archers/javelins/slingers) much more valuable in killing off the enemy crew. I guess it makes sense, in ancient warfare at sea, you would want to pepper the other ship with fire arrows.

Ramming and boarding are no longer that tactically effective in this mod.

It's a interesting explanation for the CA's bug. I hope it is not made by your MOD. I am now trying some more tactical operation to avoid these kind of tangling problem. But if I have a strong fighting navy then I may consider boarding. This MOD also make the transport fleet more dangerous than the vanilla version, which is interesting as well.

Well, ships during the period often got fouled up on each other, tangled, stuck. This is the point that they would usually board each other. The idea here is that the fleet battles are supposed to be clumsy, and messy, as was historically the case. So that particular issue I actually like -- that once you ram, the fleets tend to get bunched together for close quarters boarding and missile attacks, which is what happened historically from what I read.

I mean the move to make them less and less responsive in acceleration is rooted in that historical description of the combat, and it makes sense, these ships were not nimble after ramming.

@Volcano467, with respect, it is a nice MOD and make the navy battle more meaningful. The bug is sometimes the ship will stuck with each other and you can not order it move around. This happens to both AI and my ships. So I am ok with this bug. I am now upgrading my technology and to see whether I can get a better fleet.

Well, I have to admit, I just don't see the ships landing and reembarking being a critical issue. Is it a headache? Yes, but its not like it breaks the scenario. The other complains about the AI or particular battle maps, has nothing to do with this mod - there are bugs in the original game in that regard. But basically, the reason I say its not critical is because it wasn't until recently that they added this feature (originally when the ships landed, they did not reembark at all, they were permanently beached). So, when I played my campaign, I looked at it as the possibility that (just like real life) some ships could be beached.

That said, I plan on looking into it, yes, but I just can't look at it at the moment, and it takes a lot of trial and error adjusting of hundreds of values to get it "just right".

this MOD is good but there are too many bugs.

nice man. I'll be waiting for that update. Keep at good work

@vavrinko(SK), yes I am looking into it. The problem is that the mod was made back in version 1.0 of Rome 2, and I kept it up (and used it), but then near the end of Rome 2's development they added the feature of ships landing and re-embarking. So, its a difficult process of keeping the core of the mod's behavior in place, but getting rid of that one thing.

I got rid of most of it (it used to get stuck all the time), but I am still working on the rest.

The ship in the photo is unrelated, it was just some artwork someone made as far as I know.

what kind of ship is that in the photo? is there a skin mod for ships?

hmm... thanks then. Any chance to fix the ships getting stuck bug?

The ship getting stuck (and not sailing away) after landing might occur with this mod, but I don't see why this mod would make them sail to the corner of the map with this mod, given that only ship performance was changed.

I never had this problem before so I assume it is related to this mod.

When I defend a city against a fleet, all the enemy ships sail to one corner of the map and then try to land at one or two places. Sometimes the ships even get stuck in the sand which prevents the other ships from landing. And one time a ship that already unloaded it's crew started rotating on the beach.
Is this a common thing, or is it possibly a conflict with another mod?

Yeah, good idea, its on my to-do list.

Thanks, i think you did a great MOD. If you can produce some video of your MDO, it will be more attractive.

As mentioned, the mod is tailored to ship upgrades, and also general (admiral) abilities, as well as ship ability boosts. In other words, it is setup so that all the abundant buffs are what is needed to really make the ships effective at ramming, as well as requiring coordinated ram attempts from multiple ships (this is historical), creating a more tactical battle that doesn't just consist of ramming.

These ship speeds have been carefully adjusted to take all this into account. Please keep giving the mod a chance with an open mind, I think it will grow on you.

I tried this mod with a long navy battle today (1 hour) . I like this mod as it makes the navy battle more challenge. Now i have to deploy tactics to use my battle ship's speed advantage to fight against transport ship which has more man-power in boarding fight.
But can you adjust the speed a little bit higher as even after a long acceleration, my battle ship can't smash the transport into pieces.

Oh, yes, OK, I thought you were referring to a specific ship type name.

What you describe is correct. As the description says, the changes make it so that ramming is no longer quick and easy, and also no longer devastating. The idea is, that you need those naval upgrades in the tech tree to make the ships effective like before, otherwise there was absolutely no incentive to getting those tech upgrades.

After getting the naval tech upgrades, ships should be effective at ramming again, although intentionally not like they were before (which ended up with ships piled up into each other, ramming each other again and again until the other side was sunk, with absolutely no need for boarding).

the fleet ship is the battle ship which is the navy. the transport ship is the army on the sea.

Hmm, not sure what you mean by the "fleet ship". Can you elaborate, please?

The fleet ship speed is too slow and can't really hurt transport ship by ram. after ram, the fleet ship can't run away quickly, which enable the transport ship board the fleet ship and win the battle by its man-power. I am not sure whether it is historical accurate for this case.

Well, it was fixed in a recent update of this mod, but if its still happened then not sure what it could be in those cases. It might just be something that comes and goes and just have to live with in some cases as best as possible, unfortunately.

Your mod is awesome! it really made the naval part more enjoyable. Keep up the good work!

I noticed some of the ships dont depart after landing troops. they get stuck. the ores go in reverse but the ship doesnt move. I read through the comments and saw other people having the same issue, is there a bug? or something to fix this ?

Not sure, best thing to do would be try it out and see.

is this compatible with DEI?

Thanks, have fun!

Amazing. Thank a ton Volcano! Best Rome II mod ever. I'll keep a lookout for what you come up with next :)

OK, I looked it over, actually the speed was good, its that the acceleration is what needed a boost. I split the difference here between my most recent change to it, and what it was before (now scaled at 1/12th instead of 1/16th). It should make a difference, allowing ships to get up to speed quicker, but still not very quickly and not quick enough for repeated ramming without some effort, or unless it is a smaller ship.

Anyway, it should be a bit better now.

OK, I had a chance to play out a custom battle, with several Egyptian Octeres ships. I can say that they definitely rammed the enemy, but he issue is that you have to build up speed to do it. The idea is that the ships are huge, and in combat they are powered purely by oars, so it takes quite a bit of time for the ship to build up speed.

As it starts moving, it looks like it is going to crawl, but after a time (a minute or so) it will gain speed.

However, I will likely still boost the movement speed of all ships by a small percentage because it wouldn't hurt. I will post here when I get around to doing it.

...might as well post a link, I guess:
https://steamhost.cn/steamcommunity_com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2404393469

No worries, thanks for the compliment, will do.

I actually don't mind the naval battles in Shogun 2 that much, my mods there concentrate on land battles and the campaign AI.

Anyways sorry for writing so much to you about your mod. I really love it and makes naval battles enjoyable in Rome II. Thanks for making it! As for Shogun 2, make sure you look into the S2TW Naval Mod V1 if you're currently planning on making a Shogun 2 naval mod, as it has many changes which improves its own naval battles. Thanks :)

Right, I will take a look at the boarding issues - I understood that, just mentioning about them not being able to ram is intentional, just in case you were wondering and because we were also talking about ramming.

@Volcano467 The issue with the Heavy Raider ships isn't that it can't ram. That's fine I agree it shouldn't be able to ram. The issue is that it can't BOARD enemies. Atm with your mod for some reason they are sitting ducks and I don't know why.

OK, sure, I can look at the Heavy Raider and the Egyptian Octares. It could be that the Octares is so big and slow that it cannot get enough speed up to ram, in which case yes, I would scale all the ships up a uniform % until it can. I will see.

By the way, if I recall I did make it so that raider ships cannot ram, because that is something that is not a tactic that they historically did (they weren't fitting with a ram either), but at least they should be able to board! Not saying that you observed the raiders not ramming earlier, just pointing that out just in case.