Thanks for trying !

i got thru the first pass then had to watch the walkthru. there is no way i could ever finish this map. way to difficult in every way for me. thanks for creating

Ah, didn't think it was still possible, I was hoping the way between cube button and faith-plate was long enough. *sigh*

The "normal" way involves cube stacking and reseting, so you don't have to deal with short timing at all, but the solution is more... interesting ^^

Compared to Toncica, my solution to the final cycle involved very few steps. In fact, it was barely more complicated than the second cycle, and involved the exact same tactics. At this point, I'm mostly sure it was unintended, albeit very creative.

I setup the cubes so I could fizzle them on the same island and still have enough time to "beat" the laser grid in a faith-plate race. I did this by using a number of advanced tactics, including air-control to push myself forward, approach of the faith plate prior to hitting it, and placing the cube at an odd angle so it took time for it to "slide" into the button. Even so, it took a lot of patience to setup and get just right and I ended up barely making it past the laser grid when it worked.

I was quite surprised when I saw Toncica's solution. It was extremely complicated compared to mine. I'll probably go back at some point and try to figure it out the intended way.

Haha I hope everyone will read your comment :p

I'm curious about your solution, because timing shouldn't be that short (actually it's not even a "stress" timing). Adjusting cubes? I guess you did the toncica's way, there is an easier one not involving putting cubes on buttons diagonnaly so they don't trigger

Indeed laser is a part I don't like in this map: if I was able to build it on hammer, there would be a big-panel with "RESET" next to it. But it's necessary to avoid trap situation.

Once I understood the rules, though, the puzzle itself was easy to solve (logically). The toughest part was the execution. That third phase was ridiculous! VERY tight timing, at least the way I did it. I probably spent 15 minutes doing nothing but adjusting cubes. I ended up pulling it off, but many times I found myself wondering whether what I was doing was intended. I kept going because it was the only way I saw forward.

There is at least one place, on the island near the exit, where you can find yourself perminantly stuck. Did you mean to put a faith plate there?

This is the first map I've played with rotating faith plates. They were put to very good use.

I would say the logic is tougher in Cycle 2, but the execution is tougher in Cycle 3.

Overall, very creative!

This puzzle was a lot easier than I thought it would be. I'm going to say that's because my expectations were blown out of proportion and NOT because the map itself is easy (because it most certainly is not!)

What took me the longest in this map was figuring out the rules. For example, I kept triggering the laser and resetting the puzzle because I thought it did something other than resetting the puzzle. When I finally made it to the final switch at the end of phase one, I ended up reloading a saved game because I thought all it did was reset everything (i.e. the same thing as the laser).

Thanks ! Usually I think up of this just when I decide to do something else important not related to portal. You know how it works .. ;)

How do you even think up of this?! Thumbs up. Favorited and Followed.

Thanks for playing, and thanks for walkthrough! I'll consider changing 2 cubes indeed..

You should use even bigger letters to spell HARD! ;)
After you understand the core of the puzzle it seems almost obvious, but getting there was hard indeed. It reminds me of a Rubic's Cube puzzle, different dimensions to consider and my memory failed so often because all of the cubes look the same. It would have been a great help to make two cubes a different type. Remarkable puzzle.
Walkthrough: http://youtu.be/Vjt1WqrUvZo

Really impressive. I have to play this again after I regain my energy. Not sure if I have actually solved it, it seemed that way. My mind has been twisted.

Darn. I forgot since gravity takes effect immediately there is at least some arcing though the portal from an angled faith plate and ceiling. So much to consider. I suppose a person could adjust sideways some but it does complicate things. I really should build one of these things to play around with. Thanks for all the feedback. Good luck in your competition.

Aaarg sorry completly forgot...

Talisac, you're not allowed to edit your puzzle during voting stage. Please don't do it next time. :)

And Here we are, I hope this is the last version :D (my computer burns every time I'm trying to edit this map :/ )

Don't worry for that, all criticisms are welcome as soon as they are argued, the only thing actually you're "out" is about "competition theme" which is something I should try to be more aware :)

Your feedbacks (and LPChip's ones) were useful, no matter if you're in or out P2LC! Please don't feel uncomfortable, comments are very welcome ^^

Your inclined plate/ceiling idea is quite nice, but I must remember that if you enter an inclined portal, you will go out with angle, and.. that could be quite problematic. Actually, I'll upgrade the map very soon with this part changed, and with some other minor changes (signalisation..) but I have to make some tests first :p

I see now you're both part of the private P2LC group. I feel like I've taken sides in something that's not my business and that's uncomfortable. You're both being quite civil but consider moving member related discussions out of public workshops. Non-members won't understand context, backstory, politics, etc.

As far as the faith plate, you could probably build to allow a natural drop-away and still retain puzzling goals. One possibility is an inclined plate/ceiling so that "reentry" and gravity dispense with finagling expected mechanics. It might add some variety and "direction" as well.

At any rate, you guys seem like a very elite group to be able to do these competitive builds. It's impressive considering all the physics that have to be taken into consideration with even small changes. Good Luck!

Thanks for criticism, and for pointing that unintended solution (happyly very partial, but still unintended.)

This "oopfp" (out of place faith plate :p ) is very required to the solution. I will think more about it, since you two agree it's "oop", but I have only a 2*2 square to find a cleverer way to do it. I don't want to make it easier (1st jump < 2nd < 3rd), but if that can make it more clear, why not.

Ok, I finally relented and watched your demo. I could get everything but the final exit jump and finally gave up.

So for criticism I have to agree with LPChip on what you call the "out of place" use of the faith plate. In fact you can use that same "oop" to get to the first button pedestal without even using the other end. Just put an elevated portal next to the wall while soaring and one by the "square" next to it to get elevated. Then portal beside the faith plate and "oop" in. But that's an exploit of design, not puzzle solving. Someone would not logically think that was intended as a solution, even if it got them to their next goal. Or at least I didn't.

Anyway I still give you plenty of credit for building a complex puzzle with clever and intricate use of assets and functions and timing. Way beyond my puzzle figuring. That's like Mensa or avid puzzler stuff. Cheers.

I am convinced you read the rules, just that you didn't got them the way I wanted it to, and if things are unclear you can always ask. But I even saw your comment that you thought Nintendo.erk's map didn't feel that circular, so I'm sure you can understand where I'm coming from. As for difficulty: don't be surprised if people get frustrated by your maps because they're too hard. Somehow the P2LC group has forced people to make really difficult maps rather than really fun maps.

3/2 ( <<') But I hope you're somehow convinced that I read the "circular theme rules" :p I don't know yet how hard will be the next one.. I try ot have a concept/idea I like, to give the players all the tools he needs to solve it (and thanks feedbacks for that), and to get a ratio difficulty/number of elements as high as I can :D (that's not totally true, but I LOVE puzzles with nothing in but challenging ^^ )

2/2 Jumps are very classical ones (for experienced players), and "out of place" faith plate is totally intended, since players will try to reach 2nd piedestral with it.. and will fail, and will be forced to use it an other way ("outside the box thinking"..). Again, you saw a straight walkthrought...

Fling action at the end gave me lot of trouble because I'm quite bad at jumping.. And because I couldn't use F6-F7 for demo, and got unlucky (and tired, and..). But when I created this, I built it so I could do it 10 times in a row without missing one, and that works. ^^'

1/2
I understand. 2nd and 3rd cycles are more a logic game, kind of Towers of Hanoi, and that's totally my point to force players to chain "elementary" actions and find the good order. You have no idea why I'm walking around in 3rd cycle because you didn't try it by yourself, so you didn't get the "rules" (which you can't really guess by seeing almost the shortest way possible to do it.) Enter the map, noclip to piedestral 1 and 2, then try.. I bet you will need 2 or 3 min.

Anyway, thanks for making a map. I hope to see an easy one next time so I can actually play it. My skill level is around 5/10 at the moment, possibly less. This is 8/10. My best used to be 7/10 so I definitely wouldn't have been able to solve this one.

Watched the demo and this is definitely far outside my skill level. At first this looked like a decent map, even though that first jump through several portals was something I never would've found, so thats why it seemed there was nothing to do (no sense of direction). And the entire map seemed pretty good for the entire 1st and 2nd cycle, but the 3rd somehow seemed pretty off. A lot of going around doing different things with the cubes (and I have really no idea what the point was in doing that, not even by seeing the demo) but the fling action at the end which gave you a lot of trouble even, and how you use the faithplate and then desperately try to jump back next to it, just seems out of place in the map. Its weird if you require the player to take a faithplate and then they have to traverse back through the same portal and attempt to land next to it.

Ah, someone tells me it was working even if version were different. Wait 5-10 min I'll make a new one!

edit: Here's a current version demo [www.dropbox.com]. Sorry for last jump, I failed 2 times :p

Hi Talisac, your demo won't work if it isn't for the current version of the map. Do you have a demo for the current version or do you have a youtube video that shows the solution?

Tough logic map, man. I'm amazed about its complexity, cheers for creating this man! I'm at the 2nd round so far :p My bet is that I have to change cubes from their original spawning position, but not so sure, maybe it's just something I'm overlooking...

Will continue tomorrow! :D

Actually I've read it. "Make a puzzle where you have to navigate away from the entrance and at a later stage in the puzzle come back to the entrance again through a different round. Make the player get the illusion they've run in a circle" You actually need to go to one place (ok it's not exactly the entrance, as the map is very open, but...), go throught the puzzle, go again to that place, re-do the puzzle (variant), go again, re-do, go again.

Here is a DEMO [www.dropbox.com] (old version, but identical solution).

I don't understand "no sense of direction in this map". 4 buttons activated --> opening 3 symbols. Square = light bridge, X = glass panel, / = exit. Piedestral button with " . " opening panel. Piedestral button with "moon" opening angled panel. You can see all that from main floor. Only thing not indicated: piedestral button activating cube dropper. Quite a harsh comment, so please tell me more :/

Is there a solution video so I judge the map based on that?

Tried the map but I can't get anything done. I get close to the exit, but I can't find out how to actually go to it. The door is open, but thats basically it. There's just no sense of direction in this map. Nothing to look at and know, ah I may have to do that next. I did of course got all the cubes on their buttons and walked around a bit. Also, this is not what I meant by a circular map. Next time read the description, not just the title.

Thanks. Lacking height on "elevated faith plate" is fully intended :) You must use it in an other way, to reach second objective. Direct jump will not work.

You can try "Cycle 2" :D

Thanks. High compliments to you on the solution to the second "squaring". And yes, the second objective is clear enough but I'm stuck in the manner you described.

I can utilize the first objective's elevated "faith plate" and use it to port into all portal areas but can't get the height I need for the second objective. I'm pretty flumexed but not ready to give up. I might try some other hard puzzles and maybe something will eventually click. If not, well, we all have our limits.

Yes, I've noticed that sometimes some bugs throw you right into goo.. Sorry for that :/ Nothing I can do there.

No spoiler on your link, since all the room is 100% visible all the time :) You're right after the 2nd cycle (congrats finding the solution, remember it for 3rd one) and you're stuck by portal jumps, because they don't give you enough height, right? Well your aim - I guess you know it - is exactly to go on plateform over your orange portal, to press piedestral button. And there is a way to get this lacking speed, involving the 2 others corners linked by light bridge. Remember your first first vertical jump.

Possible spoiler. Made it this far. http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/52114618439872987/8D197A55F101A81025737D6C42474DE247BEA00B/

Sometimes on what is normally a diagonal launch I'll get launched straight ahead and die. I haven't figured out if this is on purpose or what triggers it.

Thanks for commenting, so you managed to reach the exit? :) I understand it's a bit confusing, but I hope it isn't for too long.

@D.o.G. : "squaring" doesn't involve portaling indeed. 1st one gives you access to first piedestral button, 2nd one to second piedestral button (triggering angled-panel) and... 3rd one will allow you to reach exit.

There's a little too much items connected to other things and it gets a bit confising. Nice work though! Thumbs up!

The square cube recepticles work great. And cubes may have previously"vibrated" because of being so closely walled on three sides.

Sadly though, I've gotten stumped. I "4 squared" and got to the first objective and finally figured out how to "4 square" under the new conditions. And I can get to all the visible white areas but can't get further. Maybe I glitched something. My second "squaring" didn't involve any portaling.

Whoa! That was fast! I feel a little dizzy.

Yes, I've noticed this bug, and I don't understand why it's happening... I'll probably try cube buttons, thanks for suggestion.

Have you a clue why there are these strange vibrating movments?

EDIT: Well, cube buttons are working just fine, thanks for comment. Map edited.
I'm just a bit sad that player can't anymore try the button by himself, but I agree that bug was too annoying..

Sometimes the square cubes don't sit right on the round buttons so they slide or vibrate off. Sometimes this happens while on other areas of the map. So why not have the square receptical buttons instead of the round ones?