Level 30 portable dispenser
Primary fire : shoot a shot that can damage enemies a small amount and refills the ammo of teammates.
Restoring ammo grants some metal by the amount of ammo restored to teammates.
(E : Restore 25 of a Heavy's Minigun, you get 10 metal, 50 you get 20, 100 you get 30, 125 you get 40, 150 you get 50, 175 you get 75, 200 ammo refills you.
+4 health regenerated per second, the regen goes down when hit based on damage (when you take a sudden 35 damage, the regen goes to 3, when you take 65 damage, it goes to 2, and when you take 105 sudden damage it goes to 1, and anything above does the same, and it goes back to 4 if you don't get hit for a certain amount of time the amount of time depends on how much damage you took, if your regen is at 1, it will take 6 seconds for regen to go back to 4. if at 3, it takes 4 seconds, if at 2, it takes 2 seconds. If it's at 4, it goes to 4 in less than a microsecond, if you blink you'll miss it.)
15% hauling speed penalty.
35% damage penalty
Cannot build dispensers
15% less ammo from ammo pickups.

idk

I think a portable should be more passive.
You replenish ammo for nearby teammates automatically if the meter is above 50%.

You should be able to build a dispenser but it can't be upgraded.

The damage penalty is too harsh, so I thought of ammo steal ability to compensate.

Level 30 Portable Dispenser

Primary Fire: Give ammo to teammate, and friendly sentries
On Hit: Steal ammo from enemy players and buildings
100% damage penalty
Heal and replenish ammo of nearby teammates
Dispenser can't be upgraded

Originally posted by KAWAII HEAVY:

I think a portable should be more passive.
You replenish ammo for nearby teammates automatically if the meter is above 50%.

You should be able to build a dispenser but it can't be upgraded.

The damage penalty is too harsh, so I thought of ammo steal ability to compensate.

Level 30 Portable Dispenser

Primary Fire: Give ammo to teammate, and friendly sentries
On Hit: Steal ammo from enemy players and buildings
100% damage penalty
Heal and replenish ammo of nearby teammates
Dispenser can't be upgraded

The steal ammo thing is a bit overpowered, and the damage pentalty makes it not worth trying, so this should be how that works

On hit : Steal 5% of your enemy's ammo, and you get 150% of the ammo you stole into metal
35% damage penalty
Dispenser costs more metal to build
Dispenser cannot be upgraded.

Originally posted by The world's last Blockbuster:

Level 30 portable dispenser
Primary fire : shoot a shot that can damage enemies a small amount and refills the ammo of teammates.
Restoring ammo grants some metal by the amount of ammo restored to teammates.
(E : Restore 25 of a Heavy's Minigun, you get 10 metal, 50 you get 20, 100 you get 30, 125 you get 40, 150 you get 50, 175 you get 75, 200 ammo refills you.
+4 health regenerated per second, the regen goes down when hit based on damage (when you take a sudden 35 damage, the regen goes to 3, when you take 65 damage, it goes to 2, and when you take 105 sudden damage it goes to 1, and anything above does the same, and it goes back to 4 if you don't get hit for a certain amount of time the amount of time depends on how much damage you took, if your regen is at 1, it will take 6 seconds for regen to go back to 4. if at 3, it takes 4 seconds, if at 2, it takes 2 seconds. If it's at 4, it goes to 4 in less than a microsecond, if you blink you'll miss it.)
15% hauling speed penalty.
35% damage penalty
Cannot build dispensers
15% less ammo from ammo pickups.

interesting, got a bit of a rescue ranger thing going on with it. However, I noticed that you can't heal teammates with it, which could be an issue.
also, can you please specify whether the hauling speed penalty is passive or only when the weapon is out?

Originally posted by KAWAII HEAVY:

I think a portable should be more passive.
You replenish ammo for nearby teammates automatically if the meter is above 50%.

You should be able to build a dispenser but it can't be upgraded.

The damage penalty is too harsh, so I thought of ammo steal ability to compensate.

Level 30 Portable Dispenser

Primary Fire: Give ammo to teammate, and friendly sentries
On Hit: Steal ammo from enemy players and buildings
100% damage penalty
Heal and replenish ammo of nearby teammates
Dispenser can't be upgraded

I have considered the idea of stealing ammo from enemies, but I saw 2 problems with it:
problem 1: it puts the engineer up close and in the line of fire. this can be somewhat fixed by having it take ammo from the enemy's clip instead of reserves, but it can still be countered by switching to melee. It will be more of a minor nuisance than anything else, especially for Heavy or Pyro with their 200-unit clips.
problem 2: It pulls focus away from the support role this weapon was intended for. This weapon is intended to fix one of engineers weaknesses on offense; he has to constantly move his gear up as his team moves forwards. The idea behind this weapon is to allow engineer to support his team on the go.
allowing him to build a dispenser with the weapon goes against this concept, as it still suffers from the issue of being an immobile object. by removing the dispenser from being buildable, we can give more power to this weapon. that's how balance works; the disadvantages are used to power the advantages.

Originally posted by Gearhart #ReworkRandomCrits:

Originally posted by The world's last Blockbuster:

Level 30 portable dispenser
Primary fire : shoot a shot that can damage enemies a small amount and refills the ammo of teammates.
Restoring ammo grants some metal by the amount of ammo restored to teammates.
(E : Restore 25 of a Heavy's Minigun, you get 10 metal, 50 you get 20, 100 you get 30, 125 you get 40, 150 you get 50, 175 you get 75, 200 ammo refills you.
+4 health regenerated per second, the regen goes down when hit based on damage (when you take a sudden 35 damage, the regen goes to 3, when you take 65 damage, it goes to 2, and when you take 105 sudden damage it goes to 1, and anything above does the same, and it goes back to 4 if you don't get hit for a certain amount of time the amount of time depends on how much damage you took, if your regen is at 1, it will take 6 seconds for regen to go back to 4. if at 3, it takes 4 seconds, if at 2, it takes 2 seconds. If it's at 4, it goes to 4 in less than a microsecond, if you blink you'll miss it.)
15% hauling speed penalty.
35% damage penalty
Cannot build dispensers
15% less ammo from ammo pickups.

interesting, got a bit of a rescue ranger thing going on with it. However, I noticed that you can't heal teammates with it, which could be an issue.
also, can you please specify whether the hauling speed penalty is passive or only when the weapon is out?

Originally posted by KAWAII HEAVY:

I think a portable should be more passive.
You replenish ammo for nearby teammates automatically if the meter is above 50%.

You should be able to build a dispenser but it can't be upgraded.

The damage penalty is too harsh, so I thought of ammo steal ability to compensate.

Level 30 Portable Dispenser

Primary Fire: Give ammo to teammate, and friendly sentries
On Hit: Steal ammo from enemy players and buildings
100% damage penalty
Heal and replenish ammo of nearby teammates
Dispenser can't be upgraded

I have considered the idea of stealing ammo from enemies, but I saw 2 problems with it:
problem 1: it puts the engineer up close and in the line of fire. this can be somewhat fixed by having it take ammo from the enemy's clip instead of reserves, but it can still be countered by switching to melee. It will be more of a minor nuisance than anything else, especially for Heavy or Pyro with their 200-unit clips.
problem 2: It pulls focus away from the support role this weapon was intended for. This weapon is intended to fix one of engineers weaknesses on offense; he has to constantly move his gear up as his team moves forwards. The idea behind this weapon is to allow engineer to support his team on the go.
allowing him to build a dispenser with the weapon goes against this concept, as it still suffers from the issue of being an immobile object. by removing the dispenser from being buildable, we can give more power to this weapon. that's how balance works; the disadvantages are used to power the advantages.

Hauling is carrying a building. It will be in effect when the toolbox is out.
Healing teammates with it would be slightly overpowered.

And building a dispenser would not destroy the weapon, it should be either not upgradable or a mini dispenser

Originally posted by The world's last Blockbuster:

And building a dispenser would not destroy the weapon, it should be either not upgradable or a mini dispenser

yeah, but if you can't build a dispenser, than having the weapon able to heal wouldn't be overpowered anymore. though i suppose making the healing be an AOE would be pretty overpowered.

Originally posted by The world's last Blockbuster:

Originally posted by Gearhart #ReworkRandomCrits:

interesting, got a bit of a rescue ranger thing going on with it. However, I noticed that you can't heal teammates with it, which could be an issue.
also, can you please specify whether the hauling speed penalty is passive or only when the weapon is out?



I have considered the idea of stealing ammo from enemies, but I saw 2 problems with it:
problem 1: it puts the engineer up close and in the line of fire. this can be somewhat fixed by having it take ammo from the enemy's clip instead of reserves, but it can still be countered by switching to melee. It will be more of a minor nuisance than anything else, especially for Heavy or Pyro with their 200-unit clips.
problem 2: It pulls focus away from the support role this weapon was intended for. This weapon is intended to fix one of engineers weaknesses on offense; he has to constantly move his gear up as his team moves forwards. The idea behind this weapon is to allow engineer to support his team on the go.
allowing him to build a dispenser with the weapon goes against this concept, as it still suffers from the issue of being an immobile object. by removing the dispenser from being buildable, we can give more power to this weapon. that's how balance works; the disadvantages are used to power the advantages.

Hauling is carrying a building. It will be in effect when the toolbox is out.
Healing teammates with it would be slightly overpowered.

oh, right, silly me. I was thinking of the "always hauling" penalty from Uncle Dane's dispenser backpack concept.

Originally posted by Gearhart #ReworkRandomCrits:

Originally posted by The world's last Blockbuster:

And building a dispenser would not destroy the weapon, it should be either not upgradable or a mini dispenser

yeah, but if you can't build a dispenser, than having the weapon able to heal wouldn't be overpowered anymore. though i suppose making the healing be an AOE would be pretty overpowered.

You cannot take away dispensers, that would be stupid.
If anything, a Dispenser down-grade
It healing people would be op regardless. And if a Medic is on your team, you can be engie and the Medic could never die, and the Heavy he’s pocketing will never run out of ammo. All that effect because 1 engie, so imagine if a ctf team had 4 engie with that weapon, sharing metal, healing each other and their buildings, and restoring ammo of teammates while healing them.
Seems fair.
1 of these in a team wouldn’t be op, but the fact is there’s 12 players per team in casual. So imagine a team on 2fort
10 engie
1 Medic
1 Heavy

All 10 engie have this weapon and the med has the stock, and Heavy has the Stock minigun

Effects : Heavy will get 11 players of quick healing, other engie will not die from them healing each other, the med won’t die either. No engie could run out of ammo, same for the Heavy. If the med ubered the Heavy. The 10 engie will attack the other team’s base. Healing each other camping, they could even cover each other while they build sentries. And they are now camped by always fully healed, never out of ammo/metal engie, plus a Heavy Medic combo.

Hell, even 4 engie or 3, maybe even 2

Originally posted by Thot Patrol:

Originally posted by Gearhart #ReworkRandomCrits:

yeah, but if you can't build a dispenser, than having the weapon able to heal wouldn't be overpowered anymore. though i suppose making the healing be an AOE would be pretty overpowered.

You cannot take away dispensers, that would be stupid.
If anything, a Dispenser down-grade
It healing people would be op regardless. And if a Medic is on your team, you can be engie and the Medic could never die, and the Heavy he’s pocketing will never run out of ammo. All that effect because 1 engie, so imagine if a ctf team had 4 engie with that weapon, sharing metal, healing each other and their buildings, and restoring ammo of teammates while healing them.
Seems fair.
1 of these in a team wouldn’t be op, but the fact is there’s 12 players per team in casual. So imagine a team on 2fort
10 engie
1 Medic
1 Heavy

All 10 engie have this weapon and the med has the stock, and Heavy has the Stock minigun

Effects : Heavy will get 11 players of quick healing, other engie will not die from them healing each other, the med won’t die either. No engie could run out of ammo, same for the Heavy. If the med ubered the Heavy. The 10 engie will attack the other team’s base. Healing each other camping, they could even cover each other while they build sentries. And they are now camped by always fully healed, never out of ammo/metal engie, plus a Heavy Medic combo.

class stacking is always OP. and how is trading the reliability of a stationary dispenser for a portable version that poses more risk (if you die, you have to start all over) stupid? Also, Valve nerfed the effectiveness of multiple healing streams on one target, they could easily do the same thing for ammo distribution.

Maybe you could try contacting the people from custom tf2 weapons and see if they can add this to their servers, tho the experience can't be compared with vanilla + this weapon only, it can provide some insight.

Here's a link to their discord: https://discord.gg/E9TvMnV

Originally posted by Gearhart #ReworkRandomCrits:

Originally posted by Thot Patrol:

You cannot take away dispensers, that would be stupid.
If anything, a Dispenser down-grade
It healing people would be op regardless. And if a Medic is on your team, you can be engie and the Medic could never die, and the Heavy he’s pocketing will never run out of ammo. All that effect because 1 engie, so imagine if a ctf team had 4 engie with that weapon, sharing metal, healing each other and their buildings, and restoring ammo of teammates while healing them.
Seems fair.
1 of these in a team wouldn’t be op, but the fact is there’s 12 players per team in casual. So imagine a team on 2fort
10 engie
1 Medic
1 Heavy

All 10 engie have this weapon and the med has the stock, and Heavy has the Stock minigun

Effects : Heavy will get 11 players of quick healing, other engie will not die from them healing each other, the med won’t die either. No engie could run out of ammo, same for the Heavy. If the med ubered the Heavy. The 10 engie will attack the other team’s base. Healing each other camping, they could even cover each other while they build sentries. And they are now camped by always fully healed, never out of ammo/metal engie, plus a Heavy Medic combo.

class stacking is always OP. and how is trading the reliability of a stationary dispenser for a portable version that poses more risk (if you die, you have to start all over) stupid? Also, Valve nerfed the effectiveness of multiple healing streams on one target, they could easily do the same thing for ammo distribution.

If a team went all heavies, all scouts, or all engies.
These classes having Brass Beasts, Force-a-natures, and Frontier Justice.
There's still a way to defeat them, go their counter, but when it's a situation like "All portable engies with 1 Medic and 1 Heavy" That's OP
But let's say the same situation with a acclaimed OP engie weapon
Widowmaker, if there was 12 of those on 1 team, it wouldn't cause as much havok as it would with 10 portable dispenser engies.
Not even more than 5 of those portable dispenser engies.


Widowmaker has infinite clips IF YOU HIT
P.Dispenser gives you team healing, infinite ammo, infinite metal, and your team infinite ammo.
If you use it.

See my meaning?

Originally posted by World's last BlockBuster:

Originally posted by Gearhart #ReworkRandomCrits:

class stacking is always OP. and how is trading the reliability of a stationary dispenser for a portable version that poses more risk (if you die, you have to start all over) stupid? Also, Valve nerfed the effectiveness of multiple healing streams on one target, they could easily do the same thing for ammo distribution.

If a team went all heavies, all scouts, or all engies.
These classes having Brass Beasts, Force-a-natures, and Frontier Justice.
There's still a way to defeat them, go their counter, but when it's a situation like "All portable engies with 1 Medic and 1 Heavy" That's OP
But let's say the same situation with a acclaimed OP engie weapon
Widowmaker, if there was 12 of those on 1 team, it wouldn't cause as much havok as it would with 10 portable dispenser engies.
Not even more than 5 of those portable dispenser engies.


Widowmaker has infinite clips IF YOU HIT
P.Dispenser gives you team healing, infinite ammo, infinite metal, and your team infinite ammo.
If you use it.

See my meaning?

but, again, a team of 11 medics and 1 heavy would also be pretty OP, as you can always count on at least one of them having full ubercharge. How is this any different?
also, unlike the medigun, the provisioner cannot overheal, and doesn't have ubercharge. So your proposed team, everyone is still very much vulnerable, with only one medic's ubercharge to protect them and one heavy's minigun to dish out damage (and I suppose mini-sentries). So it would actually be easier to combat than an "11 medic 1 heavy" team. Additionally, healing sources don't stack, and healing is reduced when you've recently taken damage, so you can still kill them faster than they can recover their health.
I suppose you could argue that the engineers would always have metal, allowing them to spam mini-sentries and teleporter exits, but that can be easily fixed in 2 steps:

1. give the provisioner a "75% less metal from dispensers" disadvantage.
   
2. give ammo dispensing the same anti-stacking nerfs that healing has.

the engineers would no longer be able to refill each other's metal supply, preventing them from being able to spam mini-sentries and teleporter exits.
also, exactly how would you defeat a team of all heavies? I've gone against a team of all heavies before, and it was a total curb stomp. their high health pools combined with their high DPS made them tough to kill, and the number of them allowed them to cover each other, preventing my team from using their slow speed to your advantage.
likewise, a team of all scouts is hard to combat because their fast speed allows them to return from respawn faster, effectively making it as if they had a larger team size.
and engie stacking, well, anyone who's tried to push the cart into the last point on badwater can tell you how much of a pain engie stacking is. all those sentries...
and I said "Class stacking" not "loadout stacking"; you're adding additional parameters, which is a logical fallacy. I'm sure the engineers in your proposed "10 engies one medic one heavy" team wouldn't all have same secondaries and melees equipped.

To summarize:

• 11 medics and 1 heavy would be more OP than 10 Provisioners 1 medic 1 heavy.
  
• the Provisioner is less powerful than the medigun do to its inability to overheal and lack of ubercharge.
  
• any advantage caused by engineers using the provisioner on each other can easily be fixed by adding a "less metal from dispensers" disadvantage.
  
• dispenser stacking can be given the same nerfs as heal stacking if it proves to be too strong.
  
• all classes have their strengths which get exaggerated when stacked, making them hard to combat.