It would be fitting if learning in the University always cost sheets, but gave more skills than normal, but less attributes than normal. It would make getting sheets a useful thing to do because normally they're not valuable.

I don't like the idea of using gems for magic learning thematically- dwarfs don't have the arcane wizard magic theme, it would be more a thing elves would do I reckon.

Maybe the workshops could be made with lots of gems though.

(42 gems is way too many for only 13x the amount of skill though. You might only be able to make 3 gems of knowledge in a whole playthrough, when you could save them and just do the reaciton 13 times.)

Originally posted by ♫:

It would be fitting if learning in the University always cost sheets, but gave more skills than normal, but less attributes than normal. It would make getting sheets a useful thing to do because normally they're not valuable.

I don't like the idea of using gems for magic learning thematically- dwarfs don't have the arcane wizard magic theme, it would be more a thing elves would do I reckon.

Maybe the workshops could be made with lots of gems though.

The paper industry is a good solution — I’ve mentioned it before. I might indeed add sheets for training without requiring the Gem of Knowledge.

Regarding the Gem of Knowledge — I played a bit yesterday and yes, 42 does seem like too much. However, raw gems are a unique resource. It feels like searching for gems gives them a real purpose, rather than just being a byproduct of mining. Initially, I wanted to spawn my own gems on the map, but I abandoned that idea because it turned out to be highly unstable (either they wouldn’t appear at all, or there would be way too many). That’s why I turned to regular gems (uncut ones) to avoid abuse with glass gems. Overall, I’m still looking for a unique item or resource that can be used without turning it into a cheat or exploit.

That's fair enough to want gems to have a purpose. For 42 gems though you would want it to be enough make a dwarf legendary in the skill, to be honest. For 1 gem, maybe it increases their level by about 1 on average?

It should be powerful enough for there should be some reason to do it over using guildhalls or on-the-job training to train dwarfs, which can make dwarfs legendary in a couple of years (and for free). So if you're spending a lot of resources, the training should probably be much faster to match.

I think in general the university should use some materials like raw fish for fish related skills. etc.
Boulder and pick for mining, with some chance that boulder will be used (is always used ingredient with some % so also being re-created)
maybe some 'learning supplies' (custom items)

I do not enjoy the 'gems of knowledge' as it seams magical but making a gem powder or requiring raw or cut gem for some 'learning supplies' sound much better IMHO.

Originally posted by ♫:

That's fair enough to want gems to have a purpose. For 42 gems though you would want it to be enough make a dwarf legendary in the skill, to be honest. For 1 gem, maybe it increases their level by about 1 on average?

It should be powerful enough for there should be some reason to do it over using guildhalls or on-the-job training to train dwarfs, which can make dwarfs legendary in a couple of years (and for free). So if you're spending a lot of resources, the training should probably be much faster to match.

I understand your take, but training a dwarf to legendary in just one season feels like an exploit :)
My idea is to make players dig and deliberately search for gems — giving them special attention during mining. I always keep an eye on the pickaxe icon now, trying to tell: is it just another ore, or finally some gems!

On a 2x2 embark, there are about 73,500 gems on the map. So collecting 42 really doesn’t sound excessive — it feels fair in that context. It usually takes around half a season — from early to mid-spring — to collect that many, if you focus on it.

But if you could make a dwarf legendary with just one Gem of Knowledge... where's the satisfaction? That’s the balancing challenge :)

I'm currently leaning toward a nerf. Maybe 42 is too much — maybe 33 could be a better starting point. I’ll need more time to test this properly in real gameplay.

Here are some other ideas I’m exploring for balance:

-Reduce (or group together) the number of workshops.

-Introduce skill training limits based on the month — for example, science skills in Granite, combat in Limestone, etc. (Not sure this is technically possible, but it’s an interesting idea.)

-Possibly add a workstation where dwarves create special scrolls — not magic, more grounded/realistic — like academic treatises. The dwarf would write one, then bring it to the university to get a skill boost.

-I'd really like to find a use for dwarven energy in this system — it feels so underused right now, and this could be a nice opportunity.

Originally posted by niemst:

I think in general the university should use some materials like raw fish for fish related skills. etc.
Boulder and pick for mining, with some chance that boulder will be used (is always used ingredient with some % so also being re-created)
maybe some 'learning supplies' (custom items)

I do not enjoy the 'gems of knowledge' as it seams magical but making a gem powder or requiring raw or cut gem for some 'learning supplies' sound much better IMHO.

Agreed — the gem might have been a mistake, or more likely just a quick solution. It’s a unique resource, and there aren’t that many of them, which made it feel like a good fit.

Now I’m leaning more toward scrolls — for example, scrolls made from gem powder used as ink, combined with a sheet.

But yes, I definitely want to move away from anything that feels magical.

Another possibility, have a lot of gems be needed to build the workshops in the first place? Then there's an upfront cost but less to keep using it. It might make sense, a fancy dwarven university would probably be covered in encrusted gemstones.

I would be sad to see the number of workshops go down because the assets are very nice, but it's fair if you want to declutter the workshop screen, haha

I would be sad to see the number of workshops go down because the assets are very nice, but it's fair if you want to declutter the workshop screen, haha [/quote]

1) Yes, now needed 10 rough gems for Jewelry. Now i trying to find funny and not easy chain of production.

2) That why i loved original mod :3 To much beautifull workshops well designed! Meanwhile i already reduced one :D