Torchlight II

Torchlight II

TL2-ACE
Seinekar 1 Mar, 2018 @ 7:12am
Classes: First Impressions on Assassin
Sup!

Have been checking the assassin!

I decided to create Test characters of all classes. Im testing it using the Endless Dungeon MOD and x3 EXP, also using console to hack character levels, restat points, and suff:

Im writing this as im testing and realizing how it works, so im mostly taking notes for myself not to forget. May "clean it a bit" and make it more clear later.

Overall i like so much the class! Great concepts and ideas there!

Somwthing "weird"

Starting stats are:

STR 0

DEX 19

FOC 5

VIT 14

? is that right or im bugged? seems strange starting with 0 on a stat.


Any skill i say nothing- Doesn´t mean i havent tried, it mostly means im ok with it : D (or may recquire further testing)

COMBAT


OUT FOR BLOOD / POISON BLADES

At first i dislike the idea of a "5 min buff". Its almost like a passive, inexpensive to cost. On most classes i´d suggest change those kind of "long lasting buffs" to "toggle skills" wich burns mana, EVEN if they spend less mana than u recover - that is, they just slower your mana regen, at least on lower levels, and drain it slower/faster as they grow up on level - Still u can always copensate with MP regen stuff..

BUT then i realized you cannot have both enable at once. So in that case it makes sense for them "long lasting buffs", as they work as passives wich excludes each other. I liek it so much.

Atm i would just suggest increase their cooldown to around 20-30 seconds, to prevent continuous switching while auto-attacking a target.

Still need to keep testing the stealing values to determine if it feels under or overpowered.

Note: both scales with FOC. remember that fixed physical damage on skills still scales with FOC not STR. I discovered this recently. (should test again anyway)

AMBUSH: I liek it but its definitely TOOO OP imo.

The ability to teleport is on itself amazing, useful for great mobility and to save yourself when surrounded and dying.

Cooldown is short enough to be able to use it very regularly (4 to 3 seconds)

But it also deals a TON of damage from weaponDPS + fixed physical damage + Huge bonus to crit chance and crit damage + stun chance... And it can even stack.

Seems way tooo much imo.Even as End-Game skill would be really OP. I suggest huge nerf on it.

My suggestion: As it is already a mobility / tactical / useful skill, let it be more just that than a damage dealer.

Cooldown to 10 seconds

Damage 61% weapon DPS+1 per level (maxed, 75%)

Chance to cause BLIND for 2 second 51%+1% per level (maxed 65%)

Crit Chance +50% for 2 seconds

Tier 1: Keep as it is. Still idk how many damage its really bleeding damage, woudl recquire further testing or data.

Tier 2: decrease 2 seconds (cooldown 8 seconds)

Tier 3: Duration 3 seconds (So not stackable, still boost the first attacks right after teleporting. i think it kinda fits a surprise attack) - Aside of duration keep as it is.

BLADE SHIELD:

Make it a toggle instead of a "long lasting buff" - wich at the end is the same as a inexpensive passive skill. Like 1 MP per second (so at lower levels, or if stacking some MP regen, it won´t "burn" MP, just make it slower to recover) - Also would make Poison Blades more useful as to take into consideration.


CUNNING


POWER KICK: Like it as it is. a regular attack with some area and a utility feature such as moving speed. Why posting it if im ok with it? idk i just liked it :D

ASSASING VEIL / HONOUR AMONG THIEVES / SHADOW MASTER

-All of 3 to be Toggle skills instead of "long lasting buffs" - as said above, that would be basically unexpensive to cast, and feel like passives. By being toggle skill it may recquire some more management and decission making of the player. Also gives more relevance to poison blades and mana leeching builds.

SHOCK TRAP:

I LIKE THIS A LOT! Thing is, it seems to do insane amounts of damage. And im not sure how the damage is calculated or on what is it based. May need a damage reduction imo, and maybe add a small chance to proc "shock" effect. But as said idk on what its damage is based, it may need some clarification.

MIND SHIELD: I found it procs tooooo easy, as in the end assassin hits SO FAST and dual wielding. also it seems to absorbs huge amounts of damage. Again idk on wich the amount of "HP" this shield has is calculated. Might need more data.

At first sight i think it totally need some way to reduce it proc chance. ATM it can permanently up.

I thought of something quite simple: It last just 5 seconds and CANNOT PROC more than once for 10 seconds.In exchange, it can get ANY amount of damage. - I think that makes the skill simpler, and even more interesting. Also it would be easier to re-balance in future just by changing the duration / "cooldown" values.

ACROBATICS:

I really dislike this. Enhancing a full stat like DEX makes it a "must have", and somehow is another passive boosting CRIT CHANCE and DODGE, wich are already boosted by few other skills. Also adding extra HP seems just me 7 cheap.

I´d suggest to fully rework this one into sth new. What about this:

When you get hit you have a Chance of 1% PER SKILL LEVEL of proc ACROBATICS:

-Adds 25% dodge chance for 3 seconds. DOES NOT STACK.
- Increases physical Armor 25% for 3 seconds DOES NOT STACK

* Or instead "does not stack" just make it "cannot proc more than once every 3 seconds"



POISON

POISON STAB: Like it, just a suggestion to make it more interesting and comfy to use:

Put cooldown on 10 seconds
Multiply its poison damage x3*** (may recquire further testing for balance)
Increase the time to 10 seconds

-So it will make overall the same DPS it does now, but won´t recquire to recast it every 3 seconds, just once every 10 seconds. 10 seconds btw should be enough to finish most heroes or "big" mobs.

***Maybe damage is TOO HIGH. may recquire further testing, but at first it feels like it should be lowered. Maybe keep damage as it is now but over 10 seconds. (That means, made the changes state above except don´t change its current damage value)

POISON DART:

Would add some more utility to it, even if to compensate its damage might be lowered in eschange.

At first i would add a debuff to enemy attack speed and enemy cast speed, starting 11% +1% per level, (so from 11 to 25%, when maxed)

To compensate, maybe lowr its damage a bit, like to 75% of what it is now. (may recquire further testing)

POISON NOVA:

Im ok with the skill itself, thing is, i feel there are many poisoning skills already, and seems a bit redundant. I get the idea it works on an area around the character, instead being a single strike (like Poison Stab) or a forward ranged attack as Poison Darts, but you could just spam darts to get same effect and with better results.

Note: I appreciate how damage is higher on melee skill, lower on ranged skill, and lower on area skill :D

POISON AURA:

U probably guessed it: Make it a "toggle skill" : D

(1 MP per level till further testing?)


POISON GLOBES:

Ohhhh i ♥♥♥♥ing love this one! so simple and so cool it looks! lol. AoE wich stays for a bit. And based on weapon DPS, wich seems rare on that class.

I´d suggest Tier 2 bonus to icnrease time from 6 to 9 seconds (6 to 7 seems not really worth it)

VENEMOUS DIRKS: So a nuke to cover most of the screen. Seems fine. Just wanted to say i tried it :D

may recquire more testing to for checking if damage is ok


POISON MASTER:

I think the poison damage is already too high on skills, also this might be a must for any1 investing on any skill of that page. I´d go with Poison bonus just 1% per level, from 1 to 15%. Still worth enough. If so, in exchange the Poison damage reduction could be 2%, from 2 to 30%.

POISON BURST:

Well thats basically the same than outlander. I would just rework it for esomething totally different, so no classes share any skill. (Placeholder, maybe?) I can thing of few "on kill" procs

-when you kill a enemy, you have a 1% per level chance of [choose any, just examples]

- fill charge bar
- recover 10% HP over 10 seconds
- Armor increase... poison damage increase.... MP regen increase...

Whatever, almost anything.

POISONED CORE:

The chance to proc is really high on melee combat. I would lower it to minimum, like 1% per level. HP regen is good enough per se, and a 1-15% chance to proc will surely happen when on combat.



All above said it may recquires more extensive testing, but i think its a starting point. Idk, share ur thoughts :D







Last edited by Seinekar; 1 Mar, 2018 @ 6:07pm
< >
Showing 1-2 of 2 comments
Corley  [developer] 1 Mar, 2018 @ 12:50pm 
Firstly, a very informative post and thanks for taking the time to post a detailed review.

You have defiantly unearthed a bug, male characters should not have 0 STR - I will fix this ASAP, some thoughs based on your feedback

Ambush
I will reduce the damage on this, I like the cooldown low as the mobility plays really well into a combat assassin, agreed the DPS is high though and will be reduced.

BLADE SHIELD/ASSASSIN VEIL / HONOUR AMONG THIEVES / SHADOW MASTER
I can make these a toggle with a mana cost per second

MIND SHIELD
i can look at your suggestions and rework

ACROBATICS:
i can look at your suggestions and rework

POISON STAB
Agreed it does a lot of damage, I can spread over more time as suggested and up the cooldown

Poison Master
Reduce bonus Posion damage to 1% per level and poison recution to 2% per level

Poison Aura
Make a toggle skill

POISON BURST:
I can look at your suggestions and rework

POISON GLOBES:
I can increase the duration from 6 -7 to 6-9 but when it stacks, or you play with a "tank" friend and manage to stack it does massive damage. Another trick is try tarrcohs tomb and pre stack when swarms appear and you will see what I mean :)

POISONED CORE:
I increased the chance at higher levels, the problem I have with this and possibly mind shield is that a melee assassin can be squishy(assasin does not use a shield) and at end game if you get 1 - 2 times you are dead, generally you don't want to get hit. I am just worried if I reduce the chance it becomes useless or only good for levelling?

i will have second read soon and make sure i did not miss any points.
Seinekar 1 Mar, 2018 @ 7:09pm 
Thxxx for taking into cosnideration!

Ok lets see:

Ambush:

What im afraid is that with a cooldown of 5-4 seconds, it can be used so frequently that make the assassin almost unkillable except for onehits, as it might be able to run away anytime. One reason i wanted ahigher cooldown is also i added it the ability to cause NLIND, wich renders teh enemy totally defenceless, being one of the most OP status. Hence, my will of increasing cooldown to not abuse of it.

[I read ur concern about assassin being squishy, ill go back into that later)

Still here a suggestion for it with lower cooldown.

Cooldown to 6 seconds. (instead of 5... at least a increase of 1 second could be ok?)

Damage 51% weapon DPS+1 per level (maxed, 65%)

Chance to cause BLIND for 2 second 31%+1% per level (maxed 45%)
***Note that blidn may render the enemy totally defenceless, its way too powerful, so the chance to proc need to be somehow low. Maybe even lower, but may recquire further testing)

Crit Chance +50% for 2 seconds

Tier 1: Keep as it is. Still idk how many damage its really bleeding damage, woudl recquire further testing or data.

Tier 2: decrease 1 seconds (cooldown 5 seconds) (1 second more than actual, may it be ok?)

Tier 3: Duration 3 seconds (So not stackable, still boost the first attacks right after teleporting. i think it kinda fits a surprise attack) - Aside of duration keep as it is.


POISON GLOBES:

Right the stack is too op. I can jsut think of 2 options:

1-Make it unable to stack, making its ability to remain on field dealing constant damage on an area its main advantage, also allowing u for great field control as you can cover huges areas with multiple throwings

2-Or nerfing its damage.

I´d go 1

*Maybe it can be done so it can stack just 2-3 times max? Would be another solution. So after the second / third stack it just refreshes but doesn´t increase damage to astronomical amounts.

POISONED CORE:

I had miss the part of poisoned core wich says yiur HP regen also increases when hit...
By what amoung exactly?

Well idk how its mechanics works, soi´d jsut post a suggestion wich may seems balanced based on what i already know.

PROC (the effect when triggered)

-Causes 20* posion damage over 3 seconds to the enemy who hit
(It will scale with focus, and i suspect, with player level)
*said damage is a placheholder, recquires testing

- Heals 3% HP over 3 seconds.*

*Again a initial value to start tesing and subject to change

BOTH CAN STACK

Now the skill itself:

Gives a HP regen of 1% per second (being a % of total HP, its more balanced at any level than a fixed amount)

Chance to proc (when player GETS DAMAGE, not block or dodge or whatever)

16% +1% per level (maxed 30%)

That would give a reasonable amount of survavility with healing plus a extra passive damage.


ABOUT ASSASSIN SURVAVILITY:

Ass does isnane damage an can stat insane amount of DoT. Being squishy seems just the right price for a class wich is seamlessly a pure damage dealer, a "Glass Cannon".

Even reworked the way i suggested, mind shield and poisoned core woudl help a lot to its survavility, but again, Assassin should be somehow squishy, as any heavy DPS should be, in shake of balance.

Still a chance to make it more endurable is ACROBATICS rework, and i think i hit the spot there : D lemme elaborate:

[Qoute myself]


ACROBATICS:

I´d suggest to fully rework this one into sth new. What about this:

Passive always active: Increases Physycal and Elemental Armor 1% per level

When you get hit you have a Chance of 12% +2% PER SKILL LEVEL (maxed, 30%) of proc ACROBATICS:

-Adds 25% dodge chance for 3 seconds. CANNOT STACK*
- Increases PHYSYCAL AND ELEMENTAL Armor 50% for 3 seconds CANNOT STACK*

*or "cannot proc more than once every 3 seconds"



Why do i think that hit the spot:

Well, Armor reduces incoming damage. It scalates with VIT, and now they would also get boosted with that skill.

So you could either go "Glass Cannon" with full FOC or STR....

Or care a bit more about getting high armor value equipment (many ppl doesn´t seem to care about armor value, just the passive bonus of items)...

AND put extra points into VIT.

VIT as HP is meaningless, but the point is VIT increase armor values. So instead of going full Glass Cannon u could put extra oint son vit (2-3 points per level, depending on how squishy u feel) and actually make Armor count.

The +25 dodge proc is mostly a "bonus" to make sure i get the cap when u are hit, for those 3 seconds. It also allow to not max DEX stat if you don´t want to.

And the sudden armor increase on hit make help you get some more hits.

-It needs to be proc on hit to make sure its not too op. If it were an always active bonus, you would be too tanky. And we do not want that. Its about giving a chance to survive, not about become a tank.

Also ability to proc is really high, when maxed, its likely it will proc every 3 hits (30% chance) and on combat u will surely get tons of hits. So it would be almost permanently up, but not always...

Also as it doesn´t procs untill u get first for a first time, u have to be carefull of that "first hit". Luckily Assassin has a ton of poisoning skills, wich debuff enemy damage. So debuff, come into combat, get hit and get the armor increase.

I think it can be tricky but once mastered it might be a pretty mechanic to master and to use.

< >
Showing 1-2 of 2 comments
Per page: 1530 50